Could use some input regarding comp&#111;nents! :O

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Posted: 28 Apr 2021 at 9:57pm

You may want to mention the type (i.e., genre) and/or some example titles of games you play for the veteran gamers to tweak suggestions. :)

Anyway, here's one suggestion. It's nearing the top of your budget.

Config #: 3885627
(To view, go to the top of the page, click "Load Config", enter the number from above, and click "Load")

Change explanations:

- Gaming doesn't utilize a lot of CPU cores. So, six to eight is plenty. The 10700K still has a high Turbo frequency, a bit faster base clock for all cores, plus is still overclockable (if desired).

- The Digital Storm M.2 drive is a bit misleading because it uses a SATA connection rather than PCIe (like NVMe M.2 drives). In other words, Digital Storm's chosen M.2 is as fast as the Samsung 860 EVO, for example. Still much faster than a HDD, but considered pokey as a main/boot drive by today's standards.

- The 3060 (12GB) is okay, although, the 3060 Ti has quite a bit more oomph!

Nvidia GeForce RTX 3060 Ti vs. Nvidia GeForce RTX 3060

Additionally, you can certainly still have Digital Storm OC the GPU (especially with it being a free service), however, most manufacturers nowadays (MSI, EVGA, Asus, etc) include OC as well as other adjustable preset profile settings in their software.

- (Not a change I made but one you might) FYI, the motherboard does not include (i.e., built-in/integrated) wireless. So, if you connect your computers to the Internet, etc via Wi-FI router, you'll want to go to the Storage / Connectivity section -> Internet / Network Access and pick one of the Wireless PCI-E adapters.

One more thing because it will be brought up. Due to the lack of current availability, Digital Storm hasn't begun offering 11th generation Intel Core CPUs. Therefore, some of this build is using last gen. tech. That's not to say it's bad, just not hugely upgradeable moving forward. Some users may strongly suggest going with an AMD Ryzen centric build because they support current tech such as PCI-E 4.0. ~~However, to be frank, unless you play more intense games, desire high FPS, or otherwise expect to need to upgrade the GPU every few years, the situation is probably moot for you.~~ And that does indeed add value, thus worth considering. How much value depends on several factors.

Edited by MrCheetah - 30 Apr 2021 at 8:33pm

Cretae

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Posted: 29 Apr 2021 at 4:14am

MrCheetah is not entirely wrong in his claim that you may get by with an Intel PCIe Generation 3 build he suggests. Get by. Truth is, PCIe Gen 4 has been available for a year and a half, and we are probably not much more than a year from Generation 5. To buy Gen 3 on purpose is like going to a garage sale for your brand new computer IMHO.

Gen 4 PCIe is 2x the throughput of Gen 3. It's a fact not all parts take advantage of that amazing boost, but storage can and does. A PCIe 4 Firecuda is ~ 30% faster than the Samsung PCIe 3 part he suggests, but there's no point in getting one for an Intel Gen 3 build. It can't run at designed speed. Current video cards have been held back so that the much larger population of Gen 3 systems would not be too gimped, but how long will that go on? Every part you might upgrade to on a system you build now will be a PCIe Gen 4 part. I can't recommend a PCIe 3 system. There's no point in coming to a custom boutique builder for a gaming rig if you're going to get 2019 tech IMO.

Intel Gen 11 CPUs are out now, but availability is scarce, so DS has not offered them. It should be coming soon here. Inquire if you need Intel. They offer PCIe 4 at last. They are capped at 8 cores, and are faster for sure, but not so much so to shame an AMD build.

In the meantime here is a build that is fully PCIe 4, and shows how under-budget such a system can be built. I guarantee it's faster than MrCheetah's suggestion simply because of the storage speed. The processors are within 5% of each other.

3887393 $2295 To see it in the Configurator, go Main Page, right corner > "Load Config" and copy/paste the #.

This a budget build to demonstrate it's not cost that recommends Intel over AMD. If you want to spend closer to your budget, feel free to sub in a Lumos case, a 5800K 8 core CPU, and perhaps go for the 3060 Ti. That brings it closer to $2700. You still have room for the RGB fans at $199, but the Lynx comes with them standard.

The top 11th generation Intel processor will cost a lot more than an AMD 5800X, perhaps cause a delay in your build, and not be essential for great gaming. The fact is that the most modern CPUs are somewhat over-powered for gaming, so there's no need for top-of-the-line processing for more than bragging rights. (Except for PCIe 4, of course.) The AMD 5600X at six cores is a great bang-for-buck gamer, and you can always upgrade to any other 5000 series proc at a later date. You may never need to on this rig.

3887393 fixed the build ID.

Edited by Cretae - 30 Apr 2021 at 3:27am

MrCheetah

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Posted: 29 Apr 2021 at 6:44am

Originally posted by Cretae

3885867 $2295 To see it in the Configurator, go Main Page, right corner > "Load Config" and copy/paste the #.

Perhaps an oops while trying different configs? That number leads me to a $2,789 Intel-based Velox build.

Anyway...

Am I opposed to an AMD build? No. I'll get back to that in a moment.

Originally posted by Cretae

Gen 4 PCIe is 2x the throughput of Gen 3. It's a fact not all parts take advantage of that amazing boost, but storage can and does. A PCIe 4 Firecuda is ~ 30% faster than the Samsung PCIe 3 part he suggests, but there's no point in getting one for an Intel Gen 3 build. It can't run at designed speed.

True, however, gaming in general benefits little from gen. 4 NVMe drives because good gen. 3 NVMe SSDs are so fast already. NVMe (PCIe) vs. SATA on the other hand can definitely be noticeable. Here are just a few videos on the subject.

GAME LOADING TIMES - Gen 4 vs Gen 3 NVME SSD

SSD NVMe PCIe 4.0 vs SSD NVMe PCIe 3.0 vs SSD SATA III Loading Windows and Games

PCIe 4.0 NVMe SSD vs PCIe 3.0 NVMe SSD vs Sata III SSD | Game Loading Times

Does that mean it's unreasonable to buy a gen. 4 SSD? No. It's just not necessary.

Originally posted by Cretae

Current video cards have been held back so that the much larger population of Gen 3 systems would not be too gimped

Tests have shown that PCIe gen. 4 does make a difference. Although, the impact is based more on FPS than anything. The system won't truly saturate the gen. 3 lanes until you push 120+ FPS at 1440p and up. Basically, again, gen. 4 is indeed nice/good to have for future proofing and pushing the limits but not entirely/always essential.

With all of that said, here's an AMD config I threw together.

Config #: 3885960

If I were going with more of my own preferences...

Config #: [Removed]

Basically, a single SSD. I know it has become common/popular to have a boot + storage drive setup. However, I don't like to span drives unless I absolutely need to. And, I'd prefer wireless built into the motherboard.

Originally posted by Cretae

You still have room for the RGB fans at $199,

I couldn't verify with certainty in the other threads... Does the Lumos include RGB fans as "standard"? I know DS doesn't mention as such, however, Corsair does -- unless I'm mistaken about something.

Crystal Series™ 570X RGB ATX Mid-Tower Case

Originally posted by Corsair

IT DOESN'T JUST LOOK COOL — IT IS COOL
With a Direct Airflow Path™ design and three included SP120 RGB LED fans, your CPU and graphics card are well-supplied with cool air for lower temperatures.

~~P.S. I hope this can stay a constructive debate/discussion and not be a my way is better than yours. :)~~

Edited by MrCheetah - 30 Apr 2021 at 8:57pm

Cretae

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Posted: 30 Apr 2021 at 4:31am

I know the data, and I acknowledged you are not wrong. I've been around here long enough to know the sometimes profound disappointment of recent purchasers that did not come for advice, and find that they just missed out on newer tech.

The data is based on NOW. None of our tech, including Windows and other app load times stands still. The Forums are replete with reports from users that they are just now back to replace a 7,8,9,10 year old DS build from the past. That longevity is never guaranteed anyone, but it's not uncommon either. My 2010 build was replaced in 2018.

My orientation has been to warn everyone that a current Intel build relies on a half-speed platform rendered obsolete (NOT useless!) in 2019. If then they wish to go ahead with the PCIe Gen 3 platform that one day may well gimp a video card upgrade, it's a choice they have. To attempt to upgrade an Intel build, say, 4 years from now would be almost pointless with a PCIe 3 handicap IMHO.

If it were not the fact AMD released Zen 3 processors last August, I would still be suggesting Intel builds alongside somewhat less pricy AMDs. The 5000 series CPUs are generally better in every respect than Intel Gen 10 CPUs, and that's when the PCIe differential became game changing IMO. I think when Intel Gen 11 hits here at DS, perhaps in a matter of days, I won't have any qualms recommending Intel builds at all. IMO, they will not render AMD builds a second class option, but for those who are determined they want the fastest single core performance, they will be THE choice again.

The DS Lumos does NOT come with RGB fans. It's always a pricy upgrade.

It would appear we both had a mishap with the build ID. Your second choice is an $8000 special purpose monster.

This is not my way is better. This is a deep knowledge from hundreds of interactions with buyers here that what they want most is the best performance and longevity they can get for the least money. Bang for the buck is my whole orientation. I never stand in the way of anyone who just wants what they want. I have stated on many occasions that I understand some folks just won't touch AMD with a ten foot pole, but it's only fair and responsible of me to assert the performance difference has disappeared, and Intel Gen 10 has a serious flaw going forward. I say for the 3rd time, YOU ARE NOT WRONG, but your Intel build is not optimal. The future upgradeability is key in my mind.

Cretae

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Posted: 30 Apr 2021 at 4:45am

@ Owlley:

Hopefully now you can see my original build in the Lynx case. Remember this is an example of a strong build at a price well below budget. There are other options available to you as I stated. One I caution you to think about is a larger secondary SSD. The 1 TB is not a bad deal at $55 extra over the HDD. Larger ones here are frankly over-priced, and SSD storage is easy to install later.

Questions?

Owlley

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Posted: 03 May 2021 at 1:36pm

Originally posted by Cretae

@ Owlley:

Hopefully now you can see my original build in the Lynx case. Remember this is an example of a strong build at a price well below budget. There are other options available to you as I stated. One I caution you to think about is a larger secondary SSD. The 1 TB is not a bad deal at $55 extra over the HDD. Larger ones here are frankly over-priced, and SSD storage is easy to install later.

Questions?

Thank you both for your input! I’ve learned a lot and answered 5 questions and gained 7 more LOL. From what I understand, you’re suggesting to go with the 3887393 build, get a second SSD thing for more room since bigger ones are more expensive. The new case comes with the lights standard (which I think is cool and he’ll love it!) and... this part confuses me. AMD is better going forward because it can be replaced. The other is... too expensive? Not being upgraded? So it is not recommended because it cannot compete right now... unless an update for it is released in the next week? I do not know what PCLs are but apparently they have something to do with AMD maybe?

(Thank you for your patience. I appreciate you all taking the time to teach me, I’ll feel a lot better knowing I made a good purchase and that he can upgrade it in the upcoming years)

Cretae

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Posted: 04 May 2021 at 4:19am

" 3887393 $2295 To see it in the Configurator, go Main Page, right corner > "Load Config" and copy/paste the #."

" If you want to spend closer to your budget, feel free to sub in a Lumos case, a 5800K 8 core CPU, and perhaps go for the 3060 Ti. That brings it closer to $2700. You still have room for the RGB fans at $199, but the Lynx comes with them standard."

This is a minimalist but strong build to show how much savings could be had and still score very good performance. You can play around with the parts as I noted within your budget, if you want to. Bigger storage drives are available for less $ online than here, and are easy to install, honest. You won't need one for maybe a year or two.

Sorry.... PCIe stands for "Peripheral Component Interconnect express". It is built into the motherboards and CPUs to provide the electronics for communication between those two and all the other parts. PCIe 3 is older, and is 1/2 the speed of PCIe 4. At this moment in time, AMD has been taking advantage of the faster platform for over a year. Intel has just recently released CPUs that use PCIe 4, but they are not available here at Digital Storm just yet.

DS has struggled mightily in the past 6 months to supply the AMD 5900X and the 5950X, but many builds have been delayed up to 3 months just waiting for one of those high-end processors. Our guess is DS is accumulating a supply of the new Intel PCIe 4 processors before they offer them, so they don't have so much of a problem. They might cost more than some of the AMD processors, but not by a lot. If you decide to go with the 5600X in the sample build, I believe you will be very happy with your performance for several years ahead. The equivalent Intel CPU, when it becomes available here will be maybe 8% faster, but that's not a lot to hold on for IMHO. At the speeds we have today, that's just not that much difference.

So, to be clear: order a 5600X or 5800X AMD CPU today, or wait on the Intel release to have more choices. The 5600X and the 5800X are both in stock, and will not delay your build.

The Lynx case does come with the RGB fans standard. AMD is better because it's newer, and all your parts now and in the future will run better. The Intel you'd have to wait on will be the same PCIe as AMD is now, and be just as upgradeable. DS could tell you about how long you'd wait.

I hope I haven't muddied the waters even more. I hesitate to choose between the 5600x and the 5800X FOR YOU, because they are both great, but the 5800 is a bit better. You do not NEED to spend the more money if you'd rather not. You could upgrade from the 5600X at some future time if you ever wanted to.

If you have more questions, we'll be here.

Owlley

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Posted: 04 May 2021 at 5:37am

Originally posted by Cretae

" 3887393 $2295 To see it in the Configurator, go Main Page, right corner > "Load Config" and copy/paste the #."

" If you want to spend closer to your budget, feel free to sub in a Lumos case, a 5800K 8 core CPU, and perhaps go for the 3060 Ti. That brings it closer to $2700. You still have room for the RGB fans at $199, but the Lynx comes with them standard."

This is a minimalist but strong build to show how much savings could be had and still score very good performance. You can play around with the parts as I noted within your budget, if you want to. Bigger storage drives are available for less $ online than here, and are easy to install, honest. You won't need one for maybe a year or two.

Sorry.... PCIe stands for "Peripheral Component Interconnect express". It is built into the motherboards and CPUs to provide the electronics for communication between those two and all the other parts. PCIe 3 is older, and is 1/2 the speed of PCIe 4. At this moment in time, AMD has been taking advantage of the faster platform for over a year. Intel has just recently released CPUs that use PCIe 4, but they are not available here at Digital Storm just yet.

DS has struggled mightily in the past 6 months to supply the AMD 5900X and the 5950X, but many builds have been delayed up to 3 months just waiting for one of those high-end processors. Our guess is DS is accumulating a supply of the new Intel PCIe 4 processors before they offer them, so they don't have so much of a problem. They might cost more than some of the AMD processors, but not by a lot. If you decide to go with the 5600X in the sample build, I believe you will be very happy with your performance for several years ahead. The equivalent Intel CPU, when it becomes available here will be maybe 8% faster, but that's not a lot to hold on for IMHO. At the speeds we have today, that's just not that much difference.

So, to be clear: order a 5600X or 5800X AMD CPU today, or wait on the Intel release to have more choices. The 5600X and the 5800X are both in stock, and will not delay your build.

The Lynx case does come with the RGB fans standard. AMD is better because it's newer, and all your parts now and in the future will run better. The Intel you'd have to wait on will be the same PCIe as AMD is now, and be just as upgradeable. DS could tell you about how long you'd wait.

I hope I haven't muddied the waters even more. I hesitate to choose between the 5600x and the 5800X FOR YOU, because they are both great, but the 5800 is a bit better. You do not NEED to spend the more money if you'd rather not. You could upgrade from the 5600X at some future time if you ever wanted to.

If you have more questions, we'll be here.

Thank you so much for clearing that all up, I super appreciate the in depth response! I think I will go with either the Lumos case and fans and the 5600x, or the lynx and 5800. 8% is not much of a difference! I had no idea they were so close.

Two last questions! Do these come with a CD slot? For disks? Or is that a component we must specify to be put in? I see options for external hard drives, but I’m wondering if these can be built in.

And finally - must the yellow internet cables be hooked into this, or is there a way to make it wireless? Is that what the dongles are for?

Again, thank you so much! I feel excited to buy this instead of anxious as before (I might even steal it sometimes to play

)

You guys have been amazing!

Edited by Owlley - 04 May 2021 at 5:52am

hoserator

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Posted: 04 May 2021 at 7:02am

You have been given a crash course!

Most, if not all systems are doing away with CD slots. Everything nowadays is downloaded from the internet. I f you want one you will have to get an external CD player.

The yellow cable is for an ethernet connection and is much better than WI-FI. Some motherboards have it (WI-FI) embedded in them, otherwise you can get a dongle.

Enjoy.

Edited by hoserator - 04 May 2021 at 7:03am

Cretae