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$8k Build

Post Date: 2010-09-03

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MagiK View Drop Down
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Topic: $8k Build
    Posted: 03 Sep 2010 at 8:44pm
So Im dropping some serious cash but Im having one problem, I want a Front Panel display that will show me the flow rate and water temp of my LCS.  Anyone know of a display that will show this info?  Ive seen them on some custom Water Cooled cases, but never found out who made the display and if it is compatible with the LCS system used by DS.  Most of the displays Ive seen only show temp and fan speed which I dont really care about, I think it more important to monitor flow rate in this kind of LCS set up.

Also looking for anyones thoughts on the Zalman "Performance" fans...what exactly do you get with thim that is better than the standard fans? Especially considering Im going for a full LCS set up.

The proposed build:
Chassis Model: Special Deal Hot Seller - Black OPS HailStorm Edition
Exterior Finish: - Standard Factory Finish
Trim Accents: Paint Chassis Vents and Grills (Red)
Processor: Intel Core i7 Extreme Edition 980X 3.33GHz (Six-Core) (Extreme Performance)
Motherboard: ASUS Rampage III Extreme (Intel X58 Chipset) (Features USB 3.0 and SATA 6Gb/s)
System Memory: 12GB DDR3 1600MHz Digital Storm Certified (Highly Recommended) (Hand Tested)
Power Supply: 1200W Corsair Pro Gold Series (CMPSU-1200AX) (Dual/Triple/Quad SLI Compatible)
Expansion Bay: - No Thanks
Hard Drive Set 1: Operating System: 1x (160GB Solid State (By: Intel) (Model: X25-M MLC Edition) (Extreme Performance)
Set 1 Raid Options: - No Thanks
Hard Drive Set 2: Multimedia\Data: 1x (600GB Western Digital VelociRaptor (10K RPM) (32MB Cache) (Model: WD6000HLHX)
Hard Drive Set 3: Backup\Misc.: 2x (2TB Western Digital (7200 RPM) (64MB Cache) (Model: Black Edition WD2001FASS)
Optical Drive 1: DVD-R/RW/CD-R/RW (DVD Writer 24x / CD-Writer 48x)
Optical Drive 2: - No Thanks
Internet Access: High Speed Network Port (Supports High-Speed Cable / DSL / Network Connections)
Video Card: 2x SLI Dual (NVIDIA GeForce GTX 480 1.5GB (PhysX) (EVGA SuperClocked+ 015-P3-1485-AR)
Add-on Card: - No Thanks
Sound Card: Integrated Motherboard Audio
Extreme Cooling: H20: Stage 6: Sub-Zero LCS Dual Loop: CPU & Dual SLI/CrossFire Video Cards & Chipset
H20 Tube Color:Black Tubing with High-Performance Fluid (UV Lighting Reactive)
Chassis Airflow: Standard Factory Chassis Fans
Internal Lighting: Internal Chassis Lighting System (UV) (Creates Glowing Effect for H20 Tubes)
Enhancements: - No Thanks
Chassis Mods: - No Thanks
Noise Reduction: Noise Suppression Package Stage 2 (Optimized Airflow & Fan Speeds with Noise Dampening Material)
Boost Processor: Stage 3: Overclock the processor between 4.2GHz to 4.4GHz (Requires i7 980X Processor)
Boost Video Card: FREE: Yes, Overclock the video card(s) as much as possible with complete stability
Boost Memory: Memory Fan Kit Only (Does not include memory overclocking service)
Boost OS: Yes, Disable and tweak all of the non-crucial services on the operating system
Windows OS: Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate (64-Bit Edition)

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Mr. View Drop Down
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  Quote Mr. Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 03 Sep 2010 at 9:52pm
LOLLOLLOLlolLOLLOLLOL
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  Quote !ender_ Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 03 Sep 2010 at 10:45pm

i agree lol

read the guide in my signature please
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 03 Sep 2010 at 11:57pm
Aside from being a less then helpful set of replies, would you like to be a bit more specific with your comments.  If I wanted to search through thousands of words I would have spent the time doing the research myself.  I was hoping that the usually mature reasonable people on this forum would be less childish and more helpful.

So since my time is rather on the valuable side, can I get some help and less judgment?
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 03 Sep 2010 at 11:59pm
On second thought perhaps I need to look into a different vendor.  Thanks anyway.
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  Quote Mr. Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 12:07am
Im pretty sure where ever you look for and pick the most expensive items, youll get a reply like that. Ender is a very helpful forum member and i also give out reasonable advice but if you go on a site and just choose the most expensive of things, its just...funny. Like ender said read his guide. Its very helpful. 
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  Quote Alex Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 12:18am
I don't think it's funny at all...

Some individuals have a large budget and just want to get the best system possible. @MagiK, I'm sorry about the behavior of some of the forum members. Genuinely everyone here would love to help you get the best system.

The Zalman fans are high-rpm fans which provide a lot of CFM (airflow) but sacrifice it with noise. Getting a fan controller will allow you to adjust your settings.

Looks like you want a very high-end performance monster since you've selected our top-end 4.2GHz+ overclocking package which requires a 980X CPU.

I don't see any issues with your build, it looks like all of the other high-end Black|Ops configs we build for customers on a daily basis.

Feel free to contact me, or email our Lead Sales Manager, Sarah ([email protected]) for official and direct help.
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  Quote Alex Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 12:22am
Originally posted by Mr.

Im pretty sure where ever you look for and pick the most expensive items, youll get a reply like that. Ender is a very helpful forum member and i also give out reasonable advice but if you go on a site and just choose the most expensive of things, its just...funny. Like ender said read his guide. Its very helpful. 

The guide is helpful to a certain point (when your on an actual budget). When you have a very high-budget (or actually none in this case), then your able to pick luxury items such as this individual has chosen.

A prime example would be DST4ME. He selected four GTX 295's, that would be a perfect example like this.
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  Quote Mr. Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 1:00am
Yes i know if he has a high budget or no budget he can get everything. But the thing is he didnt post up what he would be using the computer for or if he just wanted it for bragging rights. He should post usage/budget/res before he goes and picks the most expensive components for his rig n just asks ppl to give suggestions. If he does that whats the diff in just saying i have no budget and i want the best build there is out there so i can burn some cash.
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  Quote Memento Mori Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 3:24am
Originally posted by MagiK

I want a Front Panel display that will show me the flow rate and water temp of my LCS.

Do you mean something like this internal AIO LCS w/ Level & Temp sensors?
http://www.frozencpu.com/products/5562/ex-wat-113/Thermaltake_Aquabay_M5_Safety_Kit_w_LCD_Display_Pump_Reservoir_CL-W0103.html?tl=g30c229&id=ZwmsUHWH


OR
Separate pieces for Internal Controller with Flow/Temp/Level Sensors...
http://www.koolance.com/water-cooling/product_info.php?product_id=797
+
http://www.koolance.com/water-cooling/product_info.php?product_id=288
+
http://www.koolance.com/water-cooling/product_info.php?product_id=985
+
http://www.koolance.com/water-cooling/product_info.php?product_id=738


Or something like this $450 External All-in-One product?
http://www.zalman.co.kr/eng/product/Product_Read.asp?idx=185


Originally posted by MagiK

Also looking for anyones thoughts on the Zalman "Performance" fans...what exactly do you get with thim that is better than the standard fans? Especially considering Im going for a full LCS set up.
Well people on here say they are louder then other brands when ran at 1800RPM 12v
One of the more popular fan Brands is Scythe GentleTyphoon 1850RPM 12v They are a really good quality radiator/case fans and seem to be pretty quite overall, db wise.

Originally posted by MagiK

Optical Drive 1: DVD-R/RW/CD-R/RW (DVD Writer 24x / CD-Writer 48x)
Are you sure you don't want a BluRay Player/Burner? (I'd say a BD Burner & your BD Collection (or Netflix) is a match made in heaven, but that's just me) ^_^
Originally posted by MagiK

Video Card: 2x SLI Dual (NVIDIA GeForce GTX 480 1.5GB (PhysX) (EVGA SuperClocked+ 015-P3-1485-AR) 
You shouldn't get a SuperClocked EVGA GPU let alone an EVGA board because it's exactly the same reference board but it just has the different Brands' sticker on it and it's Overclocked from the factory which you could do by yourself (for free) or with the help of some of the forum members on here.  Or at least save some $'s and get the STANDARD EVGA GTX 480 GPUs if you want to be loyal to a specific brand.
Originally posted by MagiK

Sound Card: Integrated Motherboard Audio
Why not get a dedicated Sound Card like the X-Fi Titanium Fatality Pro or higher? if your budget is THAT high then you should think about it at least, or if you have good surround sound system then definitely go for an X-Fi Card!
Originally posted by MagiK

Extreme Cooling: H20: Stage 6: Sub-Zero LCS Dual Loop: CPU & Dual SLI/CrossFire Video Cards & Chipset 
You can't and shouldn't liquid cool the ASUS Motherboard (CHIPSET) so save the $190  or at least double check with DSO on Tuesday if it's even needed as I heard that ASUS R3E MB's can survive pretty good under extreme overclocked temps. So get a Stage 6 Dual Loop w/ 2x GPU and CPU LCS system instead. (No Chipset water blocks)
Originally posted by MagiK

Noise Reduction: Noise Suppression Package Stage 2 (Optimized Airflow & Fan Speeds with Noise Dampening Material) 
I was told by several  knowledgeable members on here that the Stage 2: Noise dampening material acts like a Thermos and increases the internal temps inside the Case, so I'd say go with the Stage 1 and they will put up 7v  switches on the fans to lower the noise of the fans or better yet get the temp control Display that occupies 2 bays especially if you don't need 2 optical drives therefore it might fit in perfectly. Doing that you could control the fan speeds/noise levels and monitor some other basic things like temps in the components. But you'd still need the little sensor gadgets like the: liquid Flow Sensor and liquid Level Sensor and liquid Temp Sensor if you want such a detailed LC System, Digital Storm can build and test it all out for you, just make sure you tell them that you want them to custom order the specific mods/gadgets/sensors, over the phone.
Originally posted by MagiK

Boost OS: Yes, Disable and tweak all of the non-crucial services on the operating system 
  I think DragoonSeal and someone else told me that if you have Digital Storm disable and tweak the Win7 OS you might miss out on some really good eye candy options and also with such a powerful processor , you shouldn't notice any difference with the tweaks or without them, I'm not sure what exactly they disable but it's always better to just Tweak  the OS yourself to your own liking as I was told, plus if you want, just call the tech team and they'll guide you on how to tweak it for free and save a little bit of $'s ^_^
Originally posted by MagiK

Windows OS: Microsoft Windows 7 Ultimate (64-Bit Edition)

If you don't speak another language or don't need a different language pack build in to the OS or some other pointless business/enterprise tools then there shouldn't be any other reason to go for Win 7 Ult as it's basically the same as Win 7 Pro...  so definitely go with Windows 7 Professional 64-bit version!


It's just a little bit of advice from me for now but I'm only one single opinion on this forums so just wait 'till some much more knowledgeable members come over and help you out further with that LCS and your custom build. Smile/
 And I'm sure Justin or Elder or Dragoon or Ablah would know a really good brand of Internal Display & Control Panel w/ LCS Monitoring Sensors and all.

It was all a dream...
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  Quote Memento Mori Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 3:35am
You should of still read that Buying and Posting Guide that !Elder told you to look at... check out the first page of it at least as you forgot to tell us any specifi details on like:
1) Uses for this Computer (games, Movies, Photoshop, multitasking,  etc...
2) Other specific needs... extra storage or LAN parties or if you want a light show inside of it lol.
3) Do you already own a Monitor and what's the Resolution you are going to use and what accesories you want to get with it like gaming peripherals or professional artwork and such...Multiple Monitors?

And please make sure to copy the Configuration 6 digit number so its easier for us to reconfigure it for you....

Originally posted by !ender_

If you want to show us build you've picked / are looking at:
-Choose your options in the configurator
-Click Save & Email on the right side
-Copy the load ticket number, scroll up to the very top right of the page and click "Load Configuration"
-Paste your ticket number and Submit, you will be taken back to the config page, the url in your explorer bar will link to your specific config, so just paste that link in your post
 
You can alternatively just click Save & Email on the right side, then scroll all the way to the bottom and copy the entire text description, and paste that in your post. I think this takes up unnecessary room and can make threads harder to read, but it is quicker.



EDIT: Oh and those Western Digital HDD's, to tell you truthfully, they cost much more to buy ON ANY Custom PC Building Boutique Site, even on this one... so my advise for you is to go on Amazon and/or NewEgg or TigerDirect or something and buy it from there; that way it would save you a ton of money that you could instead use to put into a COMPLETELY CUSTOM ORDERED and awesome Liquid Cooling System that Digital Storm can build and test for ya. =)

EDIT2: But still get the Main Intel 160gb OS SSD from Digital Storm 'cause they would test and benchmark it and also insure it for however many years you've chosen. Oh ! BTW there is something about a 4 yeaar promo on the front page , I'm not sure if you wanted to have 4 or 5 years thou, but don't forget that it's like 3 years free Repairs and 5 years free Labor work coverage (I think) maybe the other way around, double check with the Sales team.

Oh and ask for Sarah, she is a really smart and knowledgeable lady in all things tech!  ^_^)/
And if they are too busy with other customers just dial the DS # and enter 151 or 115 for Sarah's extension, and leave her a message asking to call back between a spesific time interval... like one or two hours. Ablahblah said it is the best way to reach them, otherwise they get overwhelmed with random-questions phone calls lol.


Edited by Memento Mori - 04 Sep 2010 at 4:20am
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  Quote !ender_ Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 9:01am
Originally posted by MagiK

Aside from being a less then helpful set of replies, would you like to be a bit more specific with your comments.  If I wanted to search through thousands of words I would have spent the time doing the research myself.  I was hoping that the usually mature reasonable people on this forum would be less childish and more helpful.

So since my time is rather on the valuable side, can I get some help and less judgment?
 
thousands of words? doing your own research? i wrote that entire guide specifically to address questions like yours. You arent the only one whos time is valuable, and the forums are free help, so you get what you pay for.
 
maybe im reading this incorrectly, forums/email can make things come accross more rude than they are intended, but this sounds pretty extremely arrogant in its wording, makes me not want to help you at all
if you want to please explain exactly what you want to do with this system, what the budget is, and anything else you hope to overcome/accomplish with it, i will gladly help you.
 
without knowing what you want to do with it, it makes answering questions near impossible. much like any other machine... without knowing a purpose for it, how could you buy one?
 
i apologize if my reply made you feel as if you were not being addressed, but like i said, i wrote the guide and spent a lot of time doing it to get all of the typically asked questions out of the way, so directing you to it makes things easier by answering all of the generic questions, giving us more time to tweak your build and solve whatever problems or concerns you may have: less time we spend on your thread answering generic and common questions means less of your AND my precious time wasted.


Edited by !ender_ - 04 Sep 2010 at 9:05am
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  Quote Synergism Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 10:13am
I just read the OP's post and he clearly only asks about LCS displays and about Zalman fans.
 
He never asked about anying whether or not the processor was too extreme or if you guys thought he had too much ram etc, No questions about if his setup for the type of usage he was going to do was too extreme. Nothing about tweaking his build. It was just about LC displays and Zalman fans.
 
I just glanced through you're guide again and you don't really hit on any of those questions he had.
 
That's probably why he thought the "lol" and the "read the guide" was pretty much unhelpful.
 
Would you guys have been more helpful if he didn't post his build in the first place and just left the first and second paragraph (his questions) instead?
 
My 2 cents.
 
On a side note, your guide helped me.
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 11:29am
1st.  Apologies for being testy last night, finished an 82 hour work week and was a bit grumpy and less tolerant than I could have been.

2nd.  Mr. seems to believe he's entitled to know my motives and means.  I disagree.  I merely asked 2 specific very reasonable questions.  I didnt ask for advice on my build or commentary on my choices.  Alex thanks for pointing this out for me.  I will be contacting you and I did finally reach Sarah after 2 weeks of dificulties trying to reach the sales team....no replies to email and no call back on phone message left.

3.  Memento thank you very much, those are exactly what I was looking for and just couldn't seem to find.  I appreciate the effort.  I didn't mention the information you requested in the second as its not at issue.  When I order the system I will explain my specific needs to the people who are putting it together for me.

4. Lender, sorry that you just do not seem to understand that it is polite to answer specifics with specifics and not just say RTFM.  Your guide which I have skimmed a while ago did not answer my specific questions though on a second run through I notice there was mention on the Zalman fans.  I don't need advice on building my system.  I know what I want and I have the means to get it.
You would make a horrible Harley salesman.

Synergism, Thanks for pointing out the real issue here.  Lenders guide is wonderful, for someone who doesn't know what they want or how to get there.
I've been buying computers and building systems since 1981, and I design and customize high end Corporate Highly Available Clustered systems.  While that doesnt help much with Wintel desktops...it does give one a certain insight and I have to say there was an awful lot of ASSUMING going on by the original 2 responders.  You are right I should not have posted the specs and just asked the two questions.

Alex, Ill be sending Sarah an Email shortly, hopefully Ill have better luck than my previous 2 attempts..


Edited by MagiK - 04 Sep 2010 at 12:21pm
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 12:11pm
To Memento:
I wanted to be a bit more social and respond to your questions separately.

The first and last product you listed were exactly the things I was looking for, than you.

Noise was the real issue, while I expect when running in max overclock mode I can expect more noise, I want a quieter system when running in a less demanding mode.  Such as surfing the web, and writing documents.


No BluRay needed, I have 16TB of DVD and BluRay stored on my media server and a very good set of drives for ripping and other functions.  The PC wont be used for viewing movies a 30 inch screen can't compete with my 65" home theater Display  ;)

I chose the superclock as I dont want to deal with doing the work myself.  I have in the past built all of my own systems.  Now my time is far more valuable to me than a minor expense increase of the product.  (Im running a Q6600 system at 3.2Ghz right now on Air)  I preferred BFG products but umm looks like they are on their way out of business.

As for the dedicated sound card, I was actually wanting to put that in, only to offload any CPU usage to the card as I want the CPU focused on doing the real work.  It was an oversight in the middle of the night  :P  Quality audio is not an issue for me, I make due with a 2.1 speaker system and my hearing isn't as refined as most audiophiles.

The Liquid cooling the chipset was an issue I intended on discussing, since I maxed out the OC request,

I read Lenders blurb about the Noise reduction packages however Im less inclined to his point of view as he seems be a bit biased.  If Im doing a full on Liquid cooling set up I believe (though I will be sure to verify) that the sound damping material trapping heat wont be a major issue as the radiators is where the heat will be ending up, and with 2 radiators one internal and one external I think the dissipation would be fine.

As for Tweaking the OS, again this is one of those issues of throwing dollars at someone else to save my own precious time...time  is my all important asset these days.  I Have in the past usually followed Black Adder's guides for disabling unnecessary Windows services.  In this case Ill let them do it for me (with detailed discussions as I do want the eye candy and the roll back features but there are dozens of things that can be turned off) and I will  re-enable the features as I want to later. 


I also chose Windows 7 Ultimate for a reason, and realize that for most purposes Home Premium would do just fine.  I know for a fact that MS has a propensity for making future upgrades far less painful for owners of the Ultimate bundle than for the lesser versions.  and I do want to play with the virtual XP functionality but thats just a side issue.  In this case I'm saving myself time and effort later, the cost is not significant in the over all scheme.

As for your parting comment, unlike Lender and Mr.  You didnt make assumptions and your comments were accurate and to the point and had useful information, you didnt just tell me to go read the manual.  Though honestly I never did ask for any opinions on my build  ;)  You were exactly the kind of person I expected to get a response from and I was most disappointed in Lender and Mr, just strikes me as horribly nosy.
Thanks again, you may have saved a sale for DS...they should pay you a commission as I was seriously considering switching vendors. 


Edited by MagiK - 04 Sep 2010 at 12:14pm
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  Quote Dragoonseal Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 12:29pm
Originally posted by MagiK

4. Lender, sorry that you just do not seem to understand that it is polite to answer specifics with specifics and not just say RTFM.  Your guide which I have skimmed a while ago did not answer my specific questions though on a second run through I notice there was mention on the Zalman fans.  I don't need advice on building my system.  I know what I want and I have the means to get it.
You would make a horrible Harley salesman.

I don't know, I think he does a pretty good job in this case.

Basically what he's trying to tell you is that this (ticket #438417) will perform exactly the same as your $8000 configuration, but is $5273 less.

Call me crazy, but a $5200 down payment on an actual Harley sounds like a pretty good sales pitch to me.
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 1:15pm
After reviewing your proposed builds these are my comments.

1.  Don't like the HAF932 case for multiple reasons,
2.  I can afford the top end extreme processor and thats what I want.
3.  Not a fan of the Evga mobo's have used many prefer the Asus.
4.  6Gb not sufficient for my desires.
5. 40gig SSD too small for my taste
6.  I want the 600Gb Velociraptor for my i/o intensive apps but dont want to pay for that much SSD storage. (however it is not totally out of the question but for now Ill stick with the Velociraptor or possibly the Cheetah)
7.  I have An extensive amount of DVD and BluRay media that will be manipulated thus I choose 2x2TB drive to compliment the 16TB SAN/Media Server I am already using.
8.  I want the super clock edition as I dont want to mess with the OC work myself I just dont have the time any more.  I would have gone with BFG over Evga in the past, not really an option anymore.

You seem to be giving some disinformation in your suggested build as well, there is NO WAY a i950 oc'd to 3.9Ghz on air is going to outperform a 980 clocked at 4.4Ghz.  Im not a noob, Im not looking for other people to tell me what I "need".

My budget and my desire allow me to do as I please.  I have NEVER once asked for advice on my build....no where in this thread will you find such a question.

I shared the system information only out a habit of erring on the side of too much information.  So to get back to the questions I did ask..Memnto is the one who got it right.  I wont call you crazy but I will call you wrong...remember I did not ask about my system configuration.  I asked about LCD displays relating to flow rate and water temperature,  and about a particular brand of fan.

I understand its human nature to kibitz, but this went far beyond that, there was wild speculation and a lot of assumptions being made. Not to mention a level of rudeness to a new member here.




Edited by MagiK - 04 Sep 2010 at 1:21pm
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  Quote Dragoonseal Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 1:40pm
I see you are too quick to fall for my trickery and deceit. So then I guess I have nothing left to contribute, I will bow out and let you spend as much as you want.

Enjoy.
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  Quote Beezie Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 2:04pm
thats an awsome build you are going for
Ds is a really good custom pc company they will go very far to get what you want for a decent price
i am glad you are going to give them a chance 

would been great fun if you posted some pictures of your rig if you end up buying from DS



Edited by Beezie - 04 Sep 2010 at 2:42pm
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  Quote Memento Mori Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 2:41pm
Oh I completely forgot that you will have everything Liquid Cooled... so definitely go for Stage 2 Noise Dampening Materials, it would be fine and lower the Overall Noise from the pump vibrations and, to some extent, for the fans themselves.

EDIT: But actually on the second thought... if you would have an LCD Control Panel in the Front Bay and if the one that you'd choose will have the Fan Speed controls or Water Pump speed controls then you should NOT get the 7v Switches (in that Stage 2 Fan Noise Upgrade section) for all the Radiator and Case fans, because that would be too much of a compromise and undermine the efficiency and the cooling power of the Radiators themselves (even by a little bit but still). So just ask Sarah or Alex to put in the Noise Dampening Materials on the walls of the case and ask them to leave the fans functioning at full 100% speeds @12v, which you could simply control with the specific Monitoring System that we have talked about in my first post. ^_^)/

By the way!  I have bought a very similarly
priced and featured DS Rig from them as you are thinking of buying too, just recently, and after some thinking and researching and with the help of Justin_Kerr and others on here... I decided to go with a Dual Push&Pull Radiator-Fan Configuration, the reason being is that I wanted my 3 GPU's and the 980X Processor to be as cool as possible under the heavy overclocked loads... but unfortunately for me, the internal 360mm GPU Radiator could not fit the Push&Pull Config because of my HAF X case that I choose BUT the outside 240mm Radiator on the back for just the 980X CPU (4.4GHz) did utilize such a dual sided fans Setup.... well DS benchmarked and tested my rig in the factory and they said that it runs beautifully and the temps were like at 72c MAX (on full load @ 12 HT i7 Cores mind you lol) which they said would be really safe and stable for the life of that CPU. 

Also the GPU's MAX temps were also in the safe functioning norm, i don't remember how much but i think about 80c MAX at full loads for hours, so that's also fine but would of been further improved if I would of choose your HailStorm case or maybe another case instead.

Just for side note, I did get the faster 2000RPM fans for all my radiators thou (Cooler Master @2000rpm) and they have the highest "advertised" CFM--> Air Flow at 90cfm listed at 12v full power, but I warn you that they have a fairly cheap acrylic like plastic enclosure. But the Fans and the Motor and Propellers/Fins themselves are really good quality thou and push a lot of air, so I thought you should know. (always check with Amazon and Newegg for the customer reviews of them still.) 

STILL: But check out those Gentle Typhoons 1850 rpm or 1450rpm as they might be your best option for really good Air pressure/flow and also lowest decibels in comparison to others.


PS: Come on fellas, give this guy a break, he said he had an 82 hours work week, that must suck freaking bad, probly sleep deprived and all plus I'm sure he is going to utilize this Rig for a bit more important things then just Gaming and other fun gibberish (home-brew benchmarking etc...) like most of us on here do lol.

Like the other thread I was involved in some time ago... in the end if you have nothing helpful to contribute or say then please just don't post anything at all (easy, problem solved lol) and please don't put up sarcastic remarks when someone is trying to get a simple advice or two about his/her build, it's better then starting another pointless verbal argument (as I have learned the hard way ^_^).

I'm still kind of a Newbie with PC tech but If from now on when I'll see a post that is similar to my build then I'll try to help out any way I can with my humble opinions or advice or two.

Good luck with your build, MagiK... and if you can't seem to find the right Advice or Setup on this DSO site, you could always try Main-Gear as I heard lots of good things from them as well as Digital-Storm, and others but the reason I specifically choose DSO is because they were the only ones(to my knowledge) with a full blown custom Liquid Cooling System Options plus DS seems to do a good job custom ordering anything the customer wants/needs , even thou they get a bit overwhelmed with demand and they have not enough tech people in their call centers... just check with BBB.org it says they have about 37 employees TOTAL... Of coarse you can't have it perfect in this world, I guess, but this company IMHO seems to be the next best thing.
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 2:59pm
Memento you read my mind, Main-Gear was the company I was thinking of with Falcon Northwest as a distant third.  The points you brought up have made me think, and since I REALLY don't like the look of the 240mm radiator hanging off the back of the case (Its going to be in a very visible place) Im thinking of looking at the Reserator XT or something similar maybe in conjunction with the 360mm radiator in the case.  I researched the Reserator a while back and liked its looks and the reviews.  I will be discussing it with Sarah soon.  Ill probably try to get the order started while the Labor Day special is on going.

I do have a preference for the larger 140mm fans on the Hailstorm Case.  large and slow moving but still getting the volume to do the job.


Edited by MagiK - 04 Sep 2010 at 3:06pm
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  Quote Memento Mori Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 3:16pm
OLD EDIT:  Also you could try that external (or typical high quality internal XSPC or Swiftech) LC pump&reservoir&Monitoring Panel/LCD in conjunction with a fan speed/temps Monitoring LCD (both of both world eh?) ...So that you could control the Radiator/Case Fan Speeds to you desires for specific hours (day night) and other situations; all while being able to Monitor the LCS efficiency with the Level/Temp/Flow Sensors. 

BTW even thou you seemed to like the physical external Zalman LC Box for LCS that I showed you, but why not check out those separate Koolance temp/flow/level Sensors and that control panel, they seem to be of high quality and are easy for DS to install, i think, as well as with that TMS-200 Software Thermal Interface Controller you could monitor everything right from your desktop! Double check with DSO thou please as it's just my one opinion. ^_^

But then again All you need is to look around for some actual customer/professional reviews of that Zalman/Koolance/ThermalTake and if it would accommodate your DUAL LOOP Stage 6 Setup then by all means go with the Zalman Hybride LCS by the way it costs like $800 but I found it for $450 on Amazon... could be even cheaper elsewhere.

EDIT2: What I really like about Main-Gear BTW is that you can actually Speak with the Tech who would actually custom build your Desktop for you, unlike DSO which only allow you to talk to the customer service and sales team and tech support team.... I actually had my Modifications not build correctly with minor mistakes, which could of been EASILY avoided if i'd send them my Config Notes maybe the for the 6th time or at least spoke with their builder people... oh well what can I say for a PC Boutique Company with ~37 people building 3-4 computers daily and getting overwhelmed with emails & phone calls every minute.  :\


Edited by Memento Mori - 04 Sep 2010 at 3:30pm
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  Quote !ender_ Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 3:28pm
Originally posted by Dragoonseal

I see you are too quick to fall for my trickery and deceit. So then I guess I have nothing left to contribute, I will bow out and let you spend as much as you want.

Enjoy.
 
im with you dragoon, lets stop pretending we know whats going on and take our biased selves out for a drink, peace
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 3:33pm
Yeah Im looking at all of the options, one of my issues is that 240mm radiator that is hung off the back of the case in the normal Stage 6 cooling it just looks bad, and since the case is going to be visible Im looking for other options for that 2nd radiator.

I was just looking at the display panel you had in your first post,  Not too much a fan of software monitoring, would prefer to have it in a display panel not loading down the system....I may be a bit obssesive regarding background tasks  that are running.....hazzard of the work I do for a living  :P


Edited by MagiK - 04 Sep 2010 at 3:33pm
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 3:37pm
Originally posted by !ender_

Originally posted by Dragoonseal

I see you are too quick to fall for my trickery and deceit. So then I guess I have nothing left to contribute, I will bow out and let you spend as much as you want.

Enjoy.
 
im with you dragoon, lets stop pretending we know whats going on and take our biased selves out for a drink, peace


I did not imply either of you didnt know what you were doing, what I indicated was you were trying to tell me what I should do and that was NOT a question I asked.
Im sorry we got off to a bad start, Im willing to let it go and move on.  I respect the work you have done, I liked your build thread with the painting and all, something I would have done years ago.  We have different needs, desires and wants.  I am able to allow you yours, please allow me mine.  I could understand if I had posted asking for advice on how to save money or buy a budget machine, but that is neither my want or need....Peace my friend, lets just drop the animosity.
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  Quote Memento Mori Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 4:18pm
Yeap, the external 240mm Rad would protrude even more out from the back if you go with Push&Pull instead of Normal Push or Pull fans' setup... my back Radiator Setup currently sticks out about 5.5" and to have a safe air flow pushing outward I have it a Total of ~9 inches from the back wall. or you could just put it along the wall to it's side like someone i saw does.


POSSIBLE BUILD SCENARIO: Something like one GPUs' 360mm XSPC Radiator inside and use those special "openings" on the back of the HailStorm case for the LC pipes... going into Zalman Reserator XT for CPU Cooling and you could always add a Temp/Flow Sensor or two inside through the LC Pipes for the First loop w/ the XSPC 360mm Radiator.  I don't know thou how or where to connect it if you don't buy that monitoring board, maybe it could be plugged directly into the ASUS RIIIE motherboard? or maybe it could be connected to the Reserator XT as an additional Sensor plugs? 

Bit more research/phone calls needing to be done here a guess, whooshh! ^_^

EDIT: Hey! You know what, it might be a good idea in the end to get the Overclocked EVGA GPU if you don't mind paying more to have it be overclocked from the get go, but it would still only be like ~4-6% difference even with the tiny OC that DS puts up on them, even thou...... it would be fully covered with DS warranty if something gets unstable/gets fried. Unlike if you ask Justin or the other forum guys to help you OC it then well.... you can just do some Tests on your GPU's (as they would tell you to) and then post the Temps during it and other Results, and then they usually give you a pretty good custom OC... but no warrantly covers the costom OC, but DS still would fix it if it goes up in flames but they would simply fix the GPU then set it back to their FactoryMade Overclocks, so its not a bad and fairly safe deal either way you choose, IMHO.   =)

EDIT3: Or actually, why not get 3 GPU's? :P then you're golden and it would not even need any OC'ing ...AND... you would pay about the same +/- $150 if you choose 3 STANDARD Nvidia GPU's vs. 2 EVGA Medium OC'ed ones!
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  Quote !ender_ Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 4:21pm
well then lets start fresh, im am aware enough to know that i can be abrasive, even arrogant, its that red hot corsican blood in me...
i guess what im trying to get out of you in my own snobby way (not being a smart ass, i know i can be snobby) is what exactly your intentions are here
 
if you go up to 12gb ram, you could be losing the chance to max out and overclock as that much can bring stability problems not to mention its almost never going to be accessed.. you mentioned adding a sound card to offlload anything on the CPU, which really couldnt matter less, in fact, adding a sound card to offset CPU load is barely effective with a q6600, which is what i used before i built my new computer
you are right that a 3.9ghz 920 on air cant compare with an extreme hex chip on water, but without knowing what you plan to do, who is to say you will need the power, furthermore putting a 920 on water can get it to just as high clocks for a fraction of the cost, unless you are going to use the extra 4 threads for something, its very advisable.
OS tweaking with black viper i think you meant, lol, i love this guy too... but we cant actually find out what they even do with this tweak, so you could be giving up compatilibty or features that you would want to use by choosing this, 7 is already lightweight and quick, it doesnt need a lot of help, and if you are a productivity nazi, this has to be approached individually, becuase every individual has different uses for windows
 
the reason i want to butt my big mouth in here is that its a configuration forum and you posting your configuration to ME looks as if there is either some question about it or at the very least you want some input on it. But, you couldnt be more right.. its your money and you will do with it as you please, i dont want to stop you, but i hate to see anyone who wants real raw power to not get it... myself being one of these people.. just with a considerably lower budget.
 
in parting ill add that regardless of what youre doing, spending that much money begs for an SSD raid set up, or your are just going to bottleneck your use on your HDD, and to stay on the bleeding edge of performance.. it should be mentioned that watercooling your GPUs makes them 50 times harder to swap out for the next best GPUs when you are ready for an upgrade, among many other things
 
dragoon is very much against spending any money that doesnt have to be spent, but that doesnt make his input invalid(most of the time, ZING) mostly the same with me. the guide is catered to lower budget because thats most of what we see 85% of the time.. even when the build config starts out like yours, which goes back to what youre actually trying to accomplish with your rig
 
id approach it a little differently... personally. regaurdless of your use you can get way WAY over 4.2 on water, even on air. you can probably get better marks out of 6 gb ram really clocked up than 12 gb because of the added complication and stability problems youll hit and raiding a set of SSDs will give it an extra boost, if the case gives you issues, you could easily pick another and just ship it to DSO to use.
 
now if you still believe i cant help, then just ignore the post, if you want to get your LCS monitor and just move on thats cool, but, if you want a machine with real power, changes can be made that will improve that layout. either way, it was a misunderstanding and i hope you love the pc however you choose to proceed from here
 
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 4:45pm
To !ender_
I just realized that is an ! not a L  Sorry for screwing up your name.
I did not go into my needs and uses for the system and realize that many people post to get info on their builds and I was sleep deprived when I posted....still am really but..what can ya do?

Ok explanations, for personal reasons I dont want to delve too deeply into what Ill be doing so Ill be ...general.  The system will be used for multiple functions both business and gaming and umm Media oriented.  I run Systems Simulations on custom software, I also frequently have multiple virtualized environments configured. (Im conisdering looking at 24GB options) while running remote training operations for up to 20 people at a time.  What I want is a system I can modify later but wont have any boundries right now.  Displays will start with Single 2560x1600 to 3 displays later as demand requires.  I wont always be running the system balls to the wall but there will be occasions.  On my current system (Q6600, GTX285 and 8GB  with multiple 300mb Velociraptors) Im not having to o much an issue with Disk I/O though I anticipate this will become more a factor 2 years down the line.  For now, My needs wants and desires are all met by this particular build.  I chose DS because I like the press they have and the word of mouth....I plan on having them upgrade this system on a 2 or 3 year basis sooooo.  I hope that explains a bit more.  

As for the SSD RAID  Big%20Smile  It hasnt been ruled out yet, I was just looking at a terrabyte SSD solution....I may still go for it.

As for the RAM issue, Im a bit bummed that you can't get the performance out of 12 or 24gb as you can out of 6 (notice no PC2000 memory options above 6gb)
but I need the space for virtual environments.

The Configuration I posted is a rough draft it is fairly accurate but I expect to have a LOT of back and forth with DS before the build is finalized.

As you can tell, Money is less important to me than it is to Dragoon, which is no knock on him, I started adult life with the shirt on my back and $40 cash.  I, like you also used to do things like build my own PC's (except for laptops I always have) but now I want someone else to deal with the mess and hassle as much as possible. 
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  Quote Dragoonseal Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 4:46pm
Originally posted by !ender_

dragoon is very much against spending any money that doesnt have to be spent, but that doesnt make his input invalid(most of the time, ZING)

KIM, I WILL DESTROY YOU.
Lilim
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3x Intel X25-M G2 (80GB) SSD RAID0
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  Quote Memento Mori Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 4:48pm
Hey !Ender, what about all the problems that come with MB & RAID'ing the SSDs and having no way to utilize TRIM on them? And the possible alignment/ destabilization problems that is more likely to happen if one of the RAID drives goes bad... for the main OS?

I was speaking extensively with Robert and Mike over the phone/emails about RAID-0 SSD's and TRIM and Intel x25m and SandForce SSD's they both seem to agree that the differences would be trivial and only seen mostly in the benchmarking of the Read/Write/Latency.

Even thou I still went with 256gb RAID-0 SSD's but I did it ONLY because I already had 2 SSDs spare lying around lol so I stuck 'em as my secondary SSD Drives as my most performance intense files/games/CS5 etc...

EDIT:   Ah!! my bad, !Ender, you might still be right that's it's worth it, as i forgot something.... the newest version of Acronis True Image 2011 already supports: "Acronis 2011 can do simultaneous multi-drive image and backups. Meaning you could make an image of every drive in your system no matter if some are RAID and some are single and restore from that Image file to every type of drive all at once. that way when you restore all your drives are restored to the exact state they were when the image was created." - from Robert's email and Mike confirmed it as well.

Sorry if I'm confusing you guys, I did not mean to, just trying to be helpful. \(O.o)/
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 4:55pm
To Memento:

As usual you are thinking along the same lines I am, again the final fate of that external radiator will be determined after I talk to DS on Monday..assuming they are open on Monday.

Im pretty committed to keeping the OS alone on a single SSD with daily image updates to the archive, any RAID SSD's will not be involved with the OS for precisely the issues you mention.  Im not a major fan of raiding the OS in my Professional life either, beyond mirroring that is. (Im old and set in my ways Hahaha)
well Older at any rate...  RAIDED SSD's for games and apps on the other hand  that's doable in my build....but maybe not now, Ill give the Raptor a good run for a couple of years.

P.S. in case you are wodering what is with all the editing of my posts after the fact...I blame it on still being waaay behind on my sleep, my typing suffers greatly  Sad


Edited by MagiK - 04 Sep 2010 at 4:56pm
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  Quote Memento Mori Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 4:57pm
Nope I've checked with Robert they're closed, but Re-Open for business on Tuesday. Upset


EDIT: Yup that's exactly how I have it Setup too (and comfortable that way with it)....signle Intel x25-M 80gb for Windows 7 OS ........... OWC RAID-0 SSD's (256gb) for everything else memory/performance intensive............. and Hitachi 2 tb for Storage and backups and other junk. ^_^


Edited by Memento Mori - 04 Sep 2010 at 5:02pm
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 5:01pm
Nuts Im going to miss the Holiday special...oh well you snooze you lose...in this case not snoozing and not having the time to place an order friday may cost me a bit Sad  On the other hand My contractor who is rebuilding my office is hinting at a delay waiting on materials....so Ordering this may take back seat till the office is finished so I have a place to put it.  Maybe Ill catch the next holiday sale...or maybe Ill just order Tuesday


@!ender_

DoH!  Yeah Black Viper, I have British Sit Coms on the brain.  Black Adder is a campy Brit show.  I really liked what he was doing with the Windows Services...I bought his CD after he disappeared for an extended period just in case he went missing again.


Edited by MagiK - 04 Sep 2010 at 5:05pm
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  Quote MagiK Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 5:18pm
Since I plan on shipping this thing back to DS on a regular basis ever few years I've opted for the wooden Shipping crate...hope its as durable as it looks.

In the end though it may not pan out that way, If Light Peak takes off like I hope it does, Im going to have to start from scratch anyhow...so many decisions. 

Memento, I have had such awful luck with Hitachi drives, I shy away from them, WD has always done well for me  even better than our corporate hardware.
I could probably get away with a smaller 120gb SSD for the OS but the 160 seems ot be a good option too, better extra room than too little.  (I suffer from data creep  :P )

!ender_  thanks for over looking my crotchety self.
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  Quote Memento Mori Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Sep 2010 at 5:18pm
I don't think you would miss anything, Sale/Discount wise, because they were finding every possible excuse to give us the 10% Discount (Love that fact) from Independence Day to Back to School Day to now Labor Day.... All had same 10% Discount options; so it shouldn't go away any time soon (knocks on wood Smile).  Also here, look, (I circled it).....
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