AMD vs. GeForce

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Hey folks, 
A couple of questions mainly related to graphics cards, with some subsequent questions on monitors.

Checking out the new R9 295x2 card. Looks pretty sweet. I've typically been a fan of nVidia cards, but the radeons I've had in the past haven't necessarily been a let down. As far as cost and number crunching goes, two of these cards in a crossfire setup (so I guess quad-crossfire, technically) isn't a terrible deal, considering if I were to go with 3 or 4 high-end GTX cards and then have them all water cooled, the cooling winds up being fairly pricey.

So I guess my question is - is there a comparison of say, 2x R9 295x2 in crossfire to 3-4 780 Ti's or Titan Black's in SLI? The benching that DS has done (links to follow) shows these cards compared to just 2x 780 Ti in SLI.

http://www.digitalstormonline.com/unlocked/amd-radeon-r9-295x2-review-world-s-fastest-gaming-graphics-card-idnum227/

http://www.digitalstormonline.com/unlocked/4-way-quad-crossfire-amd-r9-295x2-benchmarks-at-4k-idnum228/

If I was only going to go for two 780 Ti's, the R9 clearly beats the pants off of them. But the build I was considering is 3x 780 Ti's with LC, and for that I was unable to find a comparison. The downside to the R9 clearly being the necessary upgrading of a PSU to a 1500W, but that actually didn't seem all too expensive, at just $30-40 higher than the 1200W.

The obvious advantage as far as I can see with the R9 cards in crossfire, is that I can reasonably expect to be able to game on a 4k resolution, judging by DS benchmarks. Mind you I will not be springing to that right away, going to wait until 4k becomes the "norm" and I don't have to drop $3k on a decent screen. However with future-proofing in mind, it does sound like a pretty sweet setup on paper.

Now for follow-up questions - as g-sync is nVidia technology, should I no longer bother with a gsync monitor if I'm going with AMD cards? Or would I still be able to take advantage of that technology?

If I can't use g-sync, is this a decent monitor? http://www.amazon.com/PB278Q-27-Inch-LED-lit-Professional-Graphics/dp/B009C3M7H0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1399489068&sr=8-1&keywords=rog+swift+pg278q 
I couldn't find the refresh rate, I was hoping for higher like 144 hz (similar to the new RoG swift that is expected to release soon, except that one would have gsync). 

Also, what the hell is "Mantle" technology for the AMD cards? Is that a separate version of the card? Is it AMD's version of g-sync?  I don't understand what it is or does, only that it shows improvements in the benches.

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Eggy Members Profile Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Groupie Joined: 19 Feb 2014 Online Status: Offline Posts: 207	Quote Reply Topic: AMD vs. GeForce Posted: 07 May 2014 at 12:40pm
	Hey folks, A couple of questions mainly related to graphics cards, with some subsequent questions on monitors. Checking out the new R9 295x2 card. Looks pretty sweet. I've typically been a fan of nVidia cards, but the radeons I've had in the past haven't necessarily been a let down. As far as cost and number crunching goes, two of these cards in a crossfire setup (so I guess quad-crossfire, technically) isn't a terrible deal, considering if I were to go with 3 or 4 high-end GTX cards and then have them all water cooled, the cooling winds up being fairly pricey. So I guess my question is - is there a comparison of say, 2x R9 295x2 in crossfire to 3-4 780 Ti's or Titan Black's in SLI? The benching that DS has done (links to follow) shows these cards compared to just 2x 780 Ti in SLI. http://www.digitalstormonline.com/unlocked/amd-radeon-r9-295x2-review-world-s-fastest-gaming-graphics-card-idnum227/ http://www.digitalstormonline.com/unlocked/4-way-quad-crossfire-amd-r9-295x2-benchmarks-at-4k-idnum228/ If I was only going to go for two 780 Ti's, the R9 clearly beats the pants off of them. But the build I was considering is 3x 780 Ti's with LC, and for that I was unable to find a comparison. The downside to the R9 clearly being the necessary upgrading of a PSU to a 1500W, but that actually didn't seem all too expensive, at just $30-40 higher than the 1200W. The obvious advantage as far as I can see with the R9 cards in crossfire, is that I can reasonably expect to be able to game on a 4k resolution, judging by DS benchmarks. Mind you I will not be springing to that right away, going to wait until 4k becomes the "norm" and I don't have to drop $3k on a decent screen. However with future-proofing in mind, it does sound like a pretty sweet setup on paper. Now for follow-up questions - as g-sync is nVidia technology, should I no longer bother with a gsync monitor if I'm going with AMD cards? Or would I still be able to take advantage of that technology? If I can't use g-sync, is this a decent monitor? http://www.amazon.com/PB278Q-27-Inch-LED-lit-Professional-Graphics/dp/B009C3M7H0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1399489068&sr=8-1&keywords=rog+swift+pg278q I couldn't find the refresh rate, I was hoping for higher like 144 hz (similar to the new RoG swift that is expected to release soon, except that one would have gsync). Also, what the hell is "Mantle" technology for the AMD cards? Is that a separate version of the card? Is it AMD's version of g-sync? I don't understand what it is or does, only that it shows improvements in the benches.

Meller Members Profile Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List DS Veteran Joined: 20 Feb 2013 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1627	Quote Reply Posted: 07 May 2014 at 2:11pm
	Mantle is like DirectX, but it's AMD's version. That's all. It's an API that developers can use, as if they'd use DirectX to help improve game play, improve graphics, etc... etc..
	Custom PC Ryzen 9 5950X Gigabyte X570 Aorus Xtreme 128GB DDR4 3600mhz EVGA RTX 3090 FTW3 Ultra Gaming Samsung 980 Pro 512GB m.2 Samsung 960 PRO 2TB m.2 x2

Nav Members Profile Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Admin Group Digital Storm Employee Joined: 15 Jan 2021 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1581	Quote Reply Posted: 07 May 2014 at 2:15pm
	Like Meller said, Mantle is an API like DIrectX. Not a lot of games support it yet but big games like BF4 show huge improvements in FPS. AMD cards currently scale better than NVIDIA and as you can see, a single 295X2 beats 2x 780 Ti so two 295X2's should have no problem beating 4x 780 Ti cards. GSYNC is NVIDIA only and it definitely is a great piece of technology if you notice frame stutters.

Eggy Members Profile Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Groupie Joined: 19 Feb 2014 Online Status: Offline Posts: 207	Quote Reply Posted: 07 May 2014 at 6:45pm
	Hmm. So right now my desktop has an HD 7570 or something along those lines. Why do programs require me to install DirectX, if Radeon cards do not take advantage of the software? I noticed on the AMD page that Mantle is supposedly going to support some sweet games I'm looking forward to (read: Star Citizen) as well as BF4 as you mentioned, Nav. How would you compare the loss of gsync to the performance boost I'd see with these cards?

Nav Members Profile Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Admin Group Digital Storm Employee Joined: 15 Jan 2021 Online Status: Offline Posts: 1581	Quote Reply Posted: 07 May 2014 at 7:37pm
	You still need DirectX for games that don't support Mantle. It really depends on the person really. The FPS boost in Mantle is really nice but so is the smoothness of GSYNC. The only issue with GSYNC is that there aren't many monitors coming out. If I had to pick, personally GSYNC is more appealing to me due to the FPS games that I play.

Eggy Members Profile Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Groupie Joined: 19 Feb 2014 Online Status: Offline Posts: 207	Quote Reply Posted: 08 May 2014 at 1:33pm
	I hear you, I play a lot of FPS games as well. Leads me along the train of thought that I should stick with the nvidia cards. Like you mentioned, it's a bummer that there's so few options for GSYNC monitors. I wish I could see an in person comparison of the two side by side so I could determine whether or not the gsync is worth holding out for. The video on RoG is kind of hard for me to see the difference, at least when they show it in Starcraft II.

Counsel Members Profile Find Members Posts Add to Buddy List Groupie Joined: 29 Sep 2013 Online Status: Offline Posts: 125	Quote Reply Posted: 08 May 2014 at 3:17pm
	FYI, Tom's Hardware has been running benchmarks on twin 295x2s for a few weeks now, and is currently advising against that setup, at least for 4K gaming. While they're theoretically well suited for the jobs, in many games they're suffering from serious stuttering issues. http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-r9-295x2-crossfire-performance,3808.html AMD may be able to sort out these issues, but I'd hold off until they do. There's no point in getting twice the average frames per second if it comes at the cost of horrible stuttering.
	Proud Slade Owner

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