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I need a new computer! (LUMOS BUILD)

Post Date: 2019-04-01

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Psimon View Drop Down
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  Quote Psimon Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Topic: I need a new computer! (LUMOS BUILD)
    Posted: 01 Apr 2019 at 6:23pm
I'm an returning DS customer with an aging computer - a 2009 CoolerMaster HAF 932, Intel i7 920 overclocked beast. This DS system will be 10 years old in September, and is still running strong! (I'd comment in the Review post I made 9 years ago, but DS seems to have deleted it Oops ).

That said, I'm looking at LUMOs build, and have lots of questions. The market has certainly changed and technology marches ever onward as usual .

Budget: around $5K, with some room up and down. Certainly I'd prefer to get the best bang for fewer bucks.

Usage: Primarily gaming. Rendering and photo editing would be nice, but I'll make do with a gaming rig's specs and strengths.

Expectations: I want to get as close to 4K gaming as I can ( I currently have a LG 34UM96 Ultrawide Monitor running 3440x1440). I'm also wanting to get an Occulus Rift or other VR headset (so that also affects Budget).

Special Needs:
Primary special need: While I want performance, stability and compatibility with games is more important. A nice (but sensible) overclock is satisfactory, or none at all if the Turbo mode for this Intel chip is sufficient (?).
Lesser Need: I want to try to run Object Desktop for a fully customizable desktop (which I imagine eats up some RAM).
Other special needs: I have a dog which sheds like mad. Big%20Smile. Components (see: fans) need to survive this on quarterly cleanings.

Specifications (Most default or "No Thanks" entries removed for clarity):
Configuration Code: 2331694
Total Price with Instant Savings: $5,419.00

Chassis Model: Digital Storm Lumos
Processor: Intel Core i9-9900K (5.0 GHz Turbo) (16-Thread) (8-Core) 3.6 GHz
Motherboard: MSI MPG Z390 GAMING PRO CARBON AC (Intel Z390 Chipset)
System Memory: 64GB DDR4 3200MHz Digital Storm Performance Series
PSU: 1000W Digital Storm Performance Series (Fully Modular) (80 Plus Gold)
Storage Set 1: 1x SSD M.2 (500GB Digital Storm M.2 Performance Series)
Storage Set 2: 1x Storage (2TB Seagate / Toshiba / Hitachi)
Storage Set 3: - No Thanks
Internet Access: High Speed Network Port (Supports High-Speed Cable / DSL / Network Connections)
Graphics Card(s): 1x GeForce RTX 2080 Ti 11GB (VR Ready)
Sound Card: Integrated Motherboard Audio
Extreme Cooling: H20: HydroLux PRO: Exotic Custom Cooling System (CPU Only)
HydroLux Tubing Style: HardLine Tubing (Requires HydroLux PRO Custom Liquid Cooling System) 
HydroLux Fluid Color: Clear Fluid + Clear Tubing
Cable Management: Exotic Cable Management - Black - (Cable Combs with Custom Color Sleeved Extension Cables)
Chassis Fans: Corsair ML PRO Series (High Static Pressure) (Magnetic Levitation)
Internal Lighting: - Remote Controlled Advanced LED Lighting System
Boost Processor: Stage 1: Overclock CPU - Up to 4.7GHz on All CPU Cores
Boost Graphics Card(s) / OS: - No Thanks
Windows OS: Microsoft Windows 10 Professional (64-Bit Edition)
Recovery Tools: USB Drive - Windows 10 Installation (Format and Clean Install)
Warranty: Life-time Expert Care with 3 Year Limited Warranty (3 Year Labor & 1 Year Part Replacement)

Options & Questions concerning this configuration:
1. LUMOs case - this is a rebranded Corsair? Which model?
2. Processor. Could go with the i7-9700K instead to save a little. Most games I've seen either can't use hyperthreading, or even suggest you disable it. Must research comparisons between the two.
3. RAM: I know 64GB is overkill, and might reduce it. However, the desktop customization I (might) use could eat up a ton of RAM. After dealing with 6GB of RAM the past 10 years, I want good RAM and lot of it.
4. Sound Card: I am fine with integrated audio, BUT the past two computers I've owned (this DS and an older model)  had issues with the audio ports going bad. Had to rely on an optical feed and that's not as full featured. Considering an audio board just to try to keep the audio functional.
5. Overclock and cooling. Overclocking is not the default selection on the Configurator. While I want performance, it must be accompanied by rock-solid reliability and operation. Yes, overclock, or No, not advised?

Cooling-wise . . . I'm thinking of a cheaper build that only uses one of those Corsair self-contained "No Maintenance" units on the CPU.It would drop about $700 off this configuration. But . . . . I like the Hydrolux Pro, want the Hardline option, and above all whichever one is the better solution. Does the Hydrolux Pro include that nice reservoir I've seen?  What does it take to get a drain valve installed so fluid replacement is easy?
I chose clear fluid & tubing, so it'll be easy to "see" when fluid needs replaced or supplemented. As for color, I would think you don't need it if you're using internal lighting(?) .

6. Chassis Fans
Going to have to research them and options. My concern is these "Levitation" corsair ones, while I like the concept, *might* be more susceptible to dog hair. We've got a lab mix that sheds enough fur to knit a new dog every 3 days.



Edited by Psimon - 01 Apr 2019 at 6:29pm
CM HAF 932*EVGA X58 3X SLI* i7920 4.0Ghz OC*6GB Mushkin RAM*EVGA Titan Sprclked*Samsung 850 Pro 1TB*Logitech Z5500*Razer Death Adder*Corsair 1000HX PSU*LG 34UM95 Monitor*Windows7Ult64
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  Quote HockeyBuck Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 02 Apr 2019 at 2:05am
Welcome back to the forum Psimon!   

I got my first DS rig in 2011, and for my 4th DS rig I recently got a Lumos.   I like a lot of your Config...will give my take on answering your questions.

1). Corsair Crystal Series 570X mid tower ATX case...awesome
      case...you’ll absolutely love it.

2)   The i7-9700K overclocks well and is the performance equal of the more
      expensive i9-9900X in gaming.    For non-gaming applications,
      Hyperthreading can be important, so you’ll have to decide that one.

3).   Yes 64 gb ram is pretty overkill.   Gaming won’t yet use more than
       16 gb RAM.    Nothing wrong with overkill if ya can afford it, but I’d
       recommend you start out with 32 gb and see if you really need more.
       (Ask for a 2 x 16 gb ram kit so you can easily add another equal set if
       you find it is needed.   It’s an easy plug in upgrade to do yourself.

4). I have used all Asus motherboards with Realtek codec on board audio
      and have been very happy listening to High Res 24/192 FLAC files or
      playing iTunes low res stuff as well.    Been able to update drivers
      too...really no problem.    Sound cards are a dying breed because
      on board audio is so darn good now.   I have not used MSI boards, but
      many here like them.   

5). Yes, do overclock the cpu you choose!    You are paying $$$ for K or X
      class processors designed by Intel specifically to be overclocked,
      and you are paying for top level cooling to make sure it stays chilly and
      stable!    Get all the performance out of those processors all the
      time sir, and DS can give you a solid & stable Stage 1 or Stage 2 OC!    
      Now, the hard line tubing isn’t flexible, and when we hear of leaks on
      the forum it’s been hard line tubing.   Shipping can be very rough on
      that stuff, and getting around it to do repairs or maintenance is harder too...
      I do recommend soft tubing if shipping the build, and you can ask DS for
      quick disconnects and a drain fitting with soft tubing.

6). I have the Corsair LL Series fans and like them, but the ML Series
      are top of line and mag lev bearings are expected to last the
      longest.   You can download Corsair iCue software to control the
      RGB color scheme.    As for dog hair... Lol...I have a big black lab
      and it really doesn’t matter what case or fans you get....hair and
      dust will find a way in....lol. ....but if you can place the new rig up on a
      table top, you will collect fewer hairs.    This rig will will be a piece of
      tech art, soomething for you to show off sir!   



Edited by HockeyBuck - 02 Apr 2019 at 2:22am
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  Quote Psimon Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 03 Apr 2019 at 7:15am
Thanks for the feedback!

Mulling over several changes to the above configuration:

1. CPU - probably stick with the i9-9900K, but considering the disabled version
i7-9700K. Price difference would pay for the upgraded Corsair fans I want.

2. GPU - I want a VR ready GPU, and 8GB of ram minimum. My current rig has an NVIDIA Titan in it (the original) and I like lots of RAM. But, golly, the price is so prohibitive on the 2080 TI 11GB !
I also looked for any GeForce 1080 TI's, there's a few new ones but the prices are insane.

3. Cooling
Hardline is out, then - good points on trying to maintenance anything around it. If it has problems shipping & leaking that's a nightmare I don't need.  I think it looks very cool but just not practical.
I'm actually looking at the Corsair 115i PRO 280 mm.
I would imagine the maintenance involved in replacing the Corsair AIO is removing it, cleaning off old thermal paste, applying new paste, and then affixing the new unit. That's very attractive.
I just hope it can handle an overclocked i9-9900K - from what I've read, they run gobble power and run HOT when overclocked.

Also - where does Digital Storm put the radiator? I've seen units with radiators in front (ugh!?) and up top (preferred).

My computer is on a nightstand next to my desk, and behind it is a window, which I open cooler days to provide cooler airflow. Trying to figure out what kind of fan configuration would be optimal . . .

4. Case: Is the front of the LUMOS case glass? Doesn't it block the airflow?



Edited by Psimon - 03 Apr 2019 at 7:19am
CM HAF 932*EVGA X58 3X SLI* i7920 4.0Ghz OC*6GB Mushkin RAM*EVGA Titan Sprclked*Samsung 850 Pro 1TB*Logitech Z5500*Razer Death Adder*Corsair 1000HX PSU*LG 34UM95 Monitor*Windows7Ult64
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  Quote HockeyBuck Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 03 Apr 2019 at 10:44am
Lol... Yes prices right now are crazy for the top end Ti gpu’s. For top performance in VR that’s prob what you will want though.

The overclocked i9-9900X runs just a little hotter than the i7-9700k but uses a little less freq and power.   The Corsair AIO coolers are great, but the full pro coolers will cool an overclocked cpu far better as you will have a better pump, added reservoir capacity and thickness, and extra coolant running through larger diameter soft tubing.    All coolers will lose some coolant to evaporation over time...but with a full pro cooler you can easily see that and keep it topped off to maintain top cooling performance. No comparison.    Surprised you don’t consider adding that expensive RTX 2080 Ti GPU to the coolant loop for best performance.

The Lumos case is glass on front, both sides and top, while back and bottom are metal mesh.   The case breathes at the open frame edges between the glass panels.   There is a video on the Corsair site that shows an exploded view of the Corsair Crystal 570X case panels.    It airs quite well and looks awesome!     They can mount a 240mm cooler on top or in front, the 280mm usually in front.    I believe Corsair makes a 360mm AIO that would also fit in the front...you would have to ask DS.   DS can get anything you want.   Personally I would suggest staying with the full HydroLux Pro cooling solution...for a cool stable long term stage 2 overclock.   




Edited by HockeyBuck - 03 Apr 2019 at 11:48am
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  Quote Cretae Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Apr 2019 at 6:52am
I simply can't see any reason why you would buy into a whole potential mess of expense, problems, and future upgrade hassles just to overclock a new CPU that is already 2 times more powerful and vastly more capable by every metric than the one you have. Your uses are not going to experience any performance differences that matter a bit in exchange for all the extra complexity you're contemplating. I'm old school, for sure. Since I turned on my first computer in 1985, I've wanted instant on/instant response. That took 25 years, an i7 930 from DS. I now have a non-oc'd 8700k and that's still what I get. You only need more if your use demands it.

The money saved by not going crazy on inessential cooling solutions easily allows for the top-end card that will get you the performance you're looking for. Keep it simple and enjoy it more. My take.
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  Quote HockeyBuck Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 04 Apr 2019 at 3:32pm
Lol... The good thing about this forum is that differing points of view are here to be had, and it’s up to each forum member to decide for themselves what’s most useful and important to them.    We each just provide our opinions and experience to help members assemble their personally desired dream build.   

In this case I think I understand Psimon’s desire here... Unlike Cretae and me, Psimon has waited a very long long time to update or replace his 10 yr old DS rig, so he wants to shoot as high as he can with the tech available to make sure the new rig performs at the best possible level, and can compete at a very high level well down the road.   That’s why we are all here as DS rig owners.    

There’s no reason to fear overclocking when DS sets up a stable sensible OC for you based on their extensive experience with the particular overclocked cpu.    Cretae is correct that AIO coolers are cheaper, no maintenance and can cool very well...and you would save some cash to use on other parts of the build, but the HydroLux Pro cooling solution can provide even better cooling performance and certainly does add a certain aesthetic to a build that many DS forum members desire.     Overclocking simply allows you to get all of the CPU performance, held back by design, that you are paying for in K or X class Intel processors.   After maintaining a 2011 Ode and 2012 Hailstorm II build that have both have kept stable Stage 2 overclocks on K class Intel processors all this time...one using an AIO cooler and the other using the HydroLux Pro cooler, I can tell you there’s been no issues with those rigs coolers or processors.   The only maintenance to the Pro cooler in 7 yrs has been to top off the reservoir with fresh coolant a couple times with a long neck squeeze bottle.    Eventually I will want to flush the system and add new coolant, but I don’t need to do anything as it’s performance has been constant and trouble free.    The AIO cooler performance has dropped a couple degrees C in 8 yrs and I’m scheming to replace it soon.    

It’s up to Psimon to decide what hardware choices get his hard earned bucks.    Gonna be a great build!
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  Quote Psimon Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 06 Apr 2019 at 7:39am
I like to hear all viewpoints, too. A good friend of mine who's not a hobbyist, but IS an engineer, echos that view - keep it simple, keep moving parts to a minimum, and certainly don't go bleeding edge. I'd save a lot of cash that way  Whoa

That said, the 10 year old system (that I paid about 5K for) I have has stood the test of time very well. I *have* upgraded the video board three times in ten years - the last update moving from SLI'd GTX 480's to a single Titan board. I've managed to play my favorite games at the highest resolutions and ultra settings, even adding mods to Skyrim, Fallout, etc, to use high resolution textures. I love having that ability.

As for the watercooling system, I also confess that in ten years, I have not performed a flush (criminal and NOT advised, so I hear). I've just monitored the levels and added coolant, as well as kept an eye out for contamination (algae, oxidization, etc). It's a miracle the pump hasn't given out, frankly.

I'm looking at a competitor's custom rig, a very very sexy version, but for nearly the same price I can get TWO water-cooled GeForce 2080 TI 11GB from Digital Storm for their ONE board setup. I won't say who (Alex would probably prefer I didn't), but  you can probably guess who it is.

I am grateful for posts like Cretae's, which brings me back around to examining my motives and asking questions - What exactly do I want from this new system, and what will I be tasking it with? Is it worth the money?

CM HAF 932*EVGA X58 3X SLI* i7920 4.0Ghz OC*6GB Mushkin RAM*EVGA Titan Sprclked*Samsung 850 Pro 1TB*Logitech Z5500*Razer Death Adder*Corsair 1000HX PSU*LG 34UM95 Monitor*Windows7Ult64
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