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New Gaming PC Build Advice

Post Date: 2021-08-18

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daveyd View Drop Down
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  Quote daveyd Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Topic: New Gaming PC Build Advice
    Posted: 18 Aug 2021 at 10:39am
Hi,

I bought my current PC from DS about 5 years ago. Other than the (Toshiba) SSD dying a couple years ago, I've had no problems. Looking to buy a new one soon and give this one to my wife. Last time I just bought whatever the cheapest pre-built Intel / Nvidia rig was, this time I'd like to customize a bit more.

Budget. I'd like to stay under $2,000. Obviously less would be great. For my needs I really don't think I need to spend a lot.

Games I play: I almost exclusively play CRPGs and turn-based strategy. Often indie games so they really don't tend to have steep requirements. I very rarely play AAA games.Possibly the most demanding game I might like to play soon is Baldur's Gate 3. Anyway, I definitely I don't need top of the line. I currently have a 1080p monitor and I doubt I'll even want to upgrade to 4K anytime soon. Maybe 1440p. Not at all interested in VR or 3D monitors. 

Case: I really never cared about chassis appearance, lights, etc. Honestly I'd probably prefer to turn off any LEDs as they're just distracting. All I care about is that it's sturdy and good airflow. So I'm pretty sure the cheapest option (Lynx?) would be fine.

Edit: I noticed under Lumos I can select a "Slade X" case which is $8 cheaper and doesn't have a side window or LED lights. So maybe that's the case I really want. Looks like it has a SD card reader and two front USB ports whereas Lynx appears to only have one? That's a big plus.  Not sure if there's any other noteworthy differences. 

CPU: I'd probably like to stick with Intel but which one I don't know. Not sure I actually need a i7 for gaming, especially given my preferences. So I was thinking that a i5-10400F would be good, unless someone wants to convince me I need something more expensive.

Cooling: I'm strongly inclined to go with the AIR 1. I've never had liquid cooling, always thought it was more about appearance and completely unnecessary, unless you don't have AC or possibly are really into OC. I don't want OC (other than Turbo Boost) and we keep our townhouse pretty cool in the summer. I'd also be concerned of possible leakage from liquid. Even if there's like a .01% chance of that I'd rather avoid. 


GPU:  I was thinking that GTX 1650 would be great. I don't really think I'll need more than that in the next few years. 

Motherboard: Here's where I have less of an idea. I was leaning towards the cheapest option (ASUS Prime Z590-P / MSI Z590). I don't think I need SLI capable and I don't use Wi-Fi. Not sure if there's some other features I should be concerned with, but the price to the next one is pretty dramatic. 

Storage: I think I want to get a 1TB SSD and maybe a 1 or 2 TB HDD. My main question is, for SSD is it worth it to get the m2 NVMe?  Currently I have a SATA3 SSD which boots very quickly and seems to have fast load times for most games I play. So is it worth paying more for the new tech? i.e., Will I really notice the difference? 

RAM: I'm thinking 16GB will be plenty. Current one has 8GB which is still above the rec for most games I play. 

PSU: I think the 600W will be plenty. 

Don't think I need any other extras. Onboard sound should be fine. 

I am leaning towards Intel & Nvidia because those are what my last 3 PCs had I'm more familiar with them, and the conventional wisdom seems to be these are the best choices for gamers. But maybe that's changed? 

So going with my current leanings Slade X

TLDR: Please recommend me a gaming desktop in the $1500 - $2000 range (hey, or less if it can be done Big%20Smile






Edited by daveyd - 14 Oct 2021 at 8:19pm
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  Quote MrCheetah Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 18 Aug 2021 at 1:27pm
I think, your conclusions are overall good/sensible; and I don't see anything wrong with your Slade X config. Although, if you have an urge to step into 1440p and BG3, I'd suggest considering the upgrade to the GTX 1660.

UserBenchmark: Nvidia GTX 1660 vs. Nvidia GTX 1650

GTX 1650 vs. GTX 1660 Game Performance Benchmarks - GPUCheck

Originally posted by daveyd

CPU: I'd probably like to stick with Intel but which one I don't know. Not sure I actually need a i7 for gaming, especially given my preferences. So I was thinking that a i5-10400F would be good, unless someone wants to convince me I need something more expensive.

For strictly gaming (and most tasks), single core clock rate/single thread performance is what matters most.

Originally posted by daveyd

Cooling: I'm strongly inclined to go with the AIR 1. I've never had liquid cooling, always thought it was more about appearance and completely unnecessary if you don't have AC or possibly are really into OC. I don't want OC (other than Turbo Boost) and we keep our townhouse pretty cool in the summer. I'd also be concerned of possible leakage from liquid. Even if there's like a .01% chance of that I'd rather avoid.

Agreed, even though I've finally done a build with an AIO cooler. For AIO, the risk of leakage is far less, however, eventual pump and possible liquid loss (via permeation) can mean less longevity.

Originally posted by daveyd

Motherboard: Here's where I have less of an idea. I was leaning towards the cheapest option (ASUS Prime Z590-P / MSI Z590). I don't think I need SLI capable and I don't use Wi-Fi. Not sure if there's some other features I should be concerned with, but the price to the next one is pretty dramatic.

Indeed. Beyond added features (e.g., integrated Wi-Fi), more expensive boards are capable of higher/better power management. None of these apply to your setup/config.

Originally posted by daveyd

Storage: I think I want to get a 1TB SSD and maybe a 1 or 2 TB HDD. My main question is, for SSD is it worth it to get the m2 NVMe? Currently I have a SATA3 SSD which boots very quickly and seems to have fast load times for most games I play. So is it worth paying more for the new tech? i.e., Will I really notice the difference?

A SATA SSD is ~5x faster than an HDD -- certainly a noticeable difference. However, a (gen. 3) NVMe is 5x to 7x faster than that -- up to 12x faster than a HDD. Overall, I'd stick with the 970 you chose.

Originally posted by daveyd

PSU: I think the 600W will be plenty.

I concur.

Originally posted by daveyd

RAM: I'm thinking 16GB will be plenty. Current one has 8GB which is still above the rec for most games I play.

Yes.

Originally posted by daveyd

I am leaning towards Intel & Nvidia because those are what my last 3 PCs had I'm more familiar with them, and the conventional wisdom seems to be these are the best choices for gamers. But maybe that's changed?

If an AMD setup would be a better value, I might say otherwise. However, I'm not seeing that.
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  Quote Cretae Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 19 Aug 2021 at 4:13am
You will be able to upgrade a 1650 GPU at more reasonable prices whenever it begins to displease you.

The only issue I want to bring to your attention is that you propose to buy a CPU that is locked into PCIe Generation 3. Gen 4 has been out for almost two years at double the bandwidth. Intel has only just produced a line of CPUs that enable that newer standard, while AMD has now TWO generations of CPUs that enable that bandwidth. The Intel proc you want is an i5-11400 or 11600, but they are not yet available here.

The equivalent competitor to the 1100 series from AMD is the 5600X which you can get here. It is reasonably priced, and will allow you to have the latest chipset platform going forward. There are so many PCIe Gen 3 computers still out there, that Gen 4 parts have been slow to market during the shortages we've seen. I think it's obvious that will not be the case even a year from now, and you may not want to be locked into a tech that's growing more obsolete by the day.

Your links couldn't take me to a build, but here is my best guess at what you'd like with the AMD proc and PCIe 4:

https://www.digitalstorm.com/configurator.asp?id=4044529

As you can see, it's a slight increase of about $50, but brings you into the 2020s. This modern platform will enable you to choose any upgrade part going forward without concern or regard to what platform it's for. Gen 4 parts will perform as they are designed instead of being gimped.

If you have any concern about the speed, effectiveness, or reliability of AMD parts, and especially this processor, just look at the reviews.   

If you wanted a better performer than this, get the Samsung 980 NVMe SSD for 5-9 times the speed of the SATA SSD. It's a gen 4 part, and amazes. Wait on a GPU upgrade.

Edited by Cretae - 19 Aug 2021 at 4:21am
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  Quote MrCheetah Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 19 Aug 2021 at 6:35am
Originally posted by Cretae

You will be able to upgrade a 1650 GPU at more reasonable prices whenever it begins to displease you.

Indeed. And yet not a "give me" decision as no one knows when or if prices will stabilize at or near MSRP.

Originally posted by Cretae

The only issue I want to bring to your attention is that you propose to buy a CPU that is locked into PCIe Generation 3. Gen 4 has been out for almost two years at double the bandwidth. Intel has only just produced a line of CPUs that enable that newer standard, while AMD has now TWO generations of CPUs that enable that bandwidth. The Intel proc you want is an i5-11400 or 11600, but they are not yet available here.

I agree, in general, but not so much in this instance -- that's not to say @daveyd shouldn't take it under advisement.

• We're looking at low to mid tier GPUs and not necessary of the current generation, which is fine for the genre. None of which will probably be overburdening gen. 3 PCIe. It's a similar situation with the storage performance demand.

• Cost is actually about $200 difference for the AMD board and CPU combo. I realize the original links didn't work -- so, you can have a Get out of Jail Free card this time :) -- but it's config # 4043435 for the Slade build and config # 4043379 for the Lynx.

With those, the prices are $1,666 or $1,674, including GTX 1660 upgrade. Again, if @daveyd wants to go with the recommendation of upgrading the graphics card later because of the crazy market currently, I understand.

Edited by MrCheetah - 19 Aug 2021 at 6:37am
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  Quote Cretae Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 20 Aug 2021 at 3:27am
I pointed out salient facts that might well be something for the OP to consider. Your points are not without merit, but your original reply didn't lay out the whole story. I've been doing this for years, and one of the uppermost motives for a poster asking for advice is to be sure they are getting what they think they are paying for. Facts are what they are. It's always up to the customer to decide what's important.

He doesn't seem to be much of an upgrader at the moment, but if that changes in 2 or 3 years, he has a seriously gimped platform at that point with a 10400F. I think that's something current buyers would want to know.
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  Quote MrCheetah Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 20 Aug 2021 at 5:34am
Originally posted by Cretae

I pointed out salient facts that might well be something for the OP to consider. Your points are not without merit, but your original reply didn't lay out the whole story.

Yes, and correct, I could and perhaps should have explained the gen. 3 vs. gen. 4 tradeoffs in my initial reply regarding the CPU choice.

I apologize if it felt/feels like I'm stepping on toes. I was countering with facts as to why I didn't see it as a big problem -- not so much as disagreeing with you. And again, you're correct, probably would have been best for me to address it initially. I mistakenly left out some explanation, which you pointed out. Ultimately, we get there.

:)
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  Quote hoserator Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 20 Aug 2021 at 5:39am
Originally posted by MrCheetah

Ultimately, we get there.

:)


Awesome
I don't know why it deleted the poster of the quote, MrCheetah! Big%20Smile
Confused




Edited by Snaike - 20 Aug 2021 at 10:11am
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  Quote MrCheetah Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 20 Aug 2021 at 10:06am
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  Quote Snaike Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 20 Aug 2021 at 10:10am
Sorry I had to edit that, hoserator, I think that's what you meant to say. I had to clean it up a bit...   
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  Quote hoserator Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 20 Aug 2021 at 1:19pm
 
Originally posted by MrCheetah

Ultimately, we get there.

:)


Awesome

[/QUOTE]

Big%20Smile
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  Quote daveyd Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 20 Aug 2021 at 7:52pm
Thanks for the feedback guys.  Awesome

If it wasn't a $200 jump to the 1660 I'd be more inclined to go with that.  For now even the 1650 is a bit of an upgrade for me (I've got a 1050ti). 

But I wonder if I might be better off trying to wait a few months before ordering.  I am not really in a huge rush.  If there's any chance of DS offering the 11400 in the near future and / or if the availability / price of GPU's might improve, then I wouldn't mind waiting until the end of the year or even early 2022. 

Otherwise the price of a AMD 5600X build isn't too bad right now.  Decisions, decisions. 


Aside from my tendency to get a new PC every 5 years, the main reason I started looking into getting one now is my wife's is starting to show it's age (10+ years). We recently replaced the PSU and now the graphics card has been having issues. Had to switch her to integrated graphics for now.  The games she plays aren't very demanding at all (mainly stuff like The Sims).  but unfortunately I don't seem to have another card.  Might be able to resolve the issue or if not I could even get her a cheap old card on eBay.  I don't want to rush into purchasing a PC because of that.








Edited by daveyd - 20 Aug 2021 at 7:59pm
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  Quote Cretae Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 21 Aug 2021 at 3:19am
Actually, this is a good time to be patient. Intel is coming with another round of CPUs before the end of the year called Alder Lake, and will be 12th generation on a smaller 10nm die. They are expected to be considerably stronger than the 11th gen released in May. Whatever is keeping DS from offering an 11th gen i5 may be resolved, and the 12th gen i5 would be the chip you want. Of course they will support PCIe gen 4, and be the best of all worlds for your build.

If you've been happy with the 1050 Ti, the 1650 is a decent step-up. I won't expect too much in price moderation in GPUs before the end of the year, but you never know. Nvidia may be able to release a flurry of cards for the holidays that bring prices down a bit.

@ MrCheetah: getting the information out is precisely the point. As I said, your points are well taken in the current instance, but I feel compelled make sure the poster has all the facts so he can make the determination what's in his best interest. I applaud his decision to wait a bit, as it may well erase all doubt as to which way to go, and result in a better all-around system.

Your voice is welcome here. Your depth of knowledge exceeds mine, and the links you provide are of great value. With Alder lake, this debate will resolve itself, and there won't BE a decision. Thanks for contributing.
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  Quote MrCheetah Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 21 Aug 2021 at 5:48am
@daveyd The biggest reason I even suggested looking at the 1660 was it actually has a notable performance difference ~50% increase. But yeah, the current price isn't good as with all graphics cards at this point.

Any who... As for waiting, I agree with @Cretae. Supposedly, Intel has some significantly improved consumer-level products on the horizon -- I normally lack excitement until a product launches. Of course, being able to wait for whatever's next is typically best, though not always possible.


@Cretae Thanks for the kind words.
Originally posted by Cretae

Your depth of knowledge exceeds mine,

I try my best to be thorough, including research. I certainly don't know everything and do make mistakes -- never easy to own up to. :) Nevertheless, I'm okay with stepping aside at times. From what I've seen, you and several other regulars here have had much more recent hands-on experience than me, an invaluable knowledge. I have casually kept up with tech but skipped more than a decade assembling or owning a desktop/tower PC. Tech specs are only a portion of the picture. My last build was in the AMD Athlon series era, when ATI was still (although ending) in existence and Biostar was a popular/mainstream motherboard brand. For example, this year was the first I handled/used a multi-slot graphics card, and now I know why several people here strongly warned me a dual RTX 3090 config without liquid cooling was more of a pipe dream.

Basically, you (and others) have insights I don't, and I'm aware of it.


... Back to our scheduled program already in progress ...

Edited by MrCheetah - 21 Aug 2021 at 5:49am
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  Quote Cretae Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 22 Aug 2021 at 3:45am


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  Quote daveyd Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 15 Dec 2021 at 7:15pm
Hey, been a few months and I'm thinking of buying it soon. Even though the 12th gen i5s are available now, I think I'm actually leaning towards the Ryzen now. 

So the build I have is https://www.digitalstorm.com/configurator.asp?id=4217962

Still debating exactly what SSD to get. I think 1TB total storage will probably be plenty for me.

I guess my main question now is which OS to get win 10 or win 11.  I was inclined to get win 10 as I'm more familiar with it and I figure there may be some issues with the new OS that haven't been resolved yet. As I understand it win 10 users can upgrade for free so I could always do it myself later. Any thoughts?

Anything else you'd suggest I change?

Thanks.
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  Quote Onkel_Ken Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 15 Dec 2021 at 8:22pm
daveyd,

If you choose Win 10 and want to easily go to Win 11 someday you can have your motherboard firmware TPM activated ahead of time in Bios by Digital Storm if you are not familiar with how to do this when you decide to go Win 11.

I just got a Win10 system and when I ordered it I paid an extra $19 to have my motherboard Win 11 ready for when I wanted to convert.

If you want them to do this for you be sure to go to STORAGE/CONNECTIVITY then EXPANSION in your build and pick Firmware TPM Activation - Windows 11 Upgrade Ready - (BIOS) [+$19]

If you go win 11 when you order they will do this automatically but if you go with Win 10 you will need to take care of the TPM activation yourself someday unless you ask DS to do it in your build.

If you can afford the extra dollars the Samsung 980 is faster. I have both the 980 & the 970. I have a smaller 500 GB 980 for OS and first tier games & a larger 1TB 970 for my game library. If I could only have 1 drive it would be a 980 for super fast speed.

I am sure a few smarter folks will jump in with some advice shortly. :-)

I am sure happy with my new DS system I got a couple weeks ago replacing the 12 year old Digital Storm beast that needed to go to pasture after a long hard gaming life.

      



Edited by Onkel_Ken - 15 Dec 2021 at 8:24pm
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  Quote Cretae Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 16 Dec 2021 at 12:46am
IMHO the SSD you selected will be fine for you. Since you won't have a 980 PRO to compare, the 970 EVO PLUS will scream past any SATA SSD you've ever used.

Your build is quite good for your price range. You might take a look at the same thing in the Intel 12600K. Here's a comparison of the two procs:

https://cpu.userbenchmark.com/Compare/Intel-Core-i5-12600K-vs-AMD-Ryzen-5-5600X/4120vs4084

And here's the same build you want with the Intel proc and an all-in-one liquid cooler:

https://www.digitalstorm.com/configurator.asp?id=4218343

The only reason it's $9 more is I included the $19 TPM firmware activation Onkel_Ken suggested. So it's actually $10 cheaper even including the cooler upgrade.

For essentially the same price, I think the Intel is tough to beat. Your call.

As to WIN 10/11, I think you have a plan. The TPM upgrade is a good idea. WIN 10 will be supported until 2025. Be sure you are aware of any sunset on the free upgrade.

You just might consider an 850W PSU for either build, so you can be ready if your GPU needs get more ambitious. If that's not you, a 3060 Ti capability is not a bad place to be.

Hope it helps.
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  Quote hoserator Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 17 Dec 2021 at 1:10am
The reviews regarding W10 vs. 11 show that all the "trusted" security costs some performance as compared to W10. W11 is being compared to Vista and W8 and you know how good they were.

I'm still running W7U and loving it. Have a system with W10 (home built) and not impressed and a laptop w/W11 and....its a laptop.


Edited by hoserator - 17 Dec 2021 at 1:12am
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  Quote daveyd Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 17 Dec 2021 at 9:00pm
Originally posted by hoserator

The reviews regarding W10 vs. 11 show that all the "trusted" security costs some performance as compared to W10. W11 is being compared to Vista and W8 and you know how good they were.

I'm still running W7U and loving it. Have a system with W10 (home built) and not impressed and a laptop w/W11 and....its a laptop.


Yep I've been reading about that. It sounds like you can disable Virtualization-Based Security and there are supposed to be fixes on the way.  There's also an issue with Nvme SSDs being slower on Win 11 than they should. Apparently there's a patch for that one already... But reading about these things made me nervous about getting Win 11 now.

I do like Win 7 (it's what's still on my wife's ~10 year old PC). Windows 10 is fine IMO but I disabled Cortana. 

I even considered getting a Linux machine, but relatively few games I play ever get official Linux support, and those that do tend to get it much later than Windows. While I've been told most Windows games will run fine with Proton / Wine, even die-hard Linux gamers usually seem to recommend having a Windows partition for when games don't.. and if I can't avoid giving Microsoft ~$100, I figure why bother?


Edited by daveyd - 17 Dec 2021 at 9:45pm
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  Quote daveyd Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 17 May 2022 at 11:07am
Still haven't ordered my next PC though I'm getting close to making my mind up about what components I want. Think I'll pull the trigger soon. I'm 99% sure I want a Ryzen 5 5600x.  And on the bright side the 1660 is now only $30 more than the 1650 now so it's a no-brainer.

But I'm finding the toughest decision to be the Motherboard. If it was just about the features I'd probably go with the cheapest option. I don't OC, don't need wifi, don't care about RGB, and doubt I'd ever need more than two PCI-e devices.... So featurewise even the cheapest option (ASUS B550 / MSI B550) would suffice.

I'm just concerned about reliability and longevity. So I've been looking up reviews of various motherboards on Amazon & Newegg and I tend to fixate on the one star reviews. It's hard not to discouraged by the "First time in 30+years a MB failed on me" reviews. I know with any piece of hardware there's going to be some lemons. Having DS build it for me would obviously prevent me from having to worry about DOA and hopefully if it passes their stress test it should probably be good for years.

But this is still a concern I have and wonder if I should splurge on one of the more expensive boards... though I'm not sure whether I can expect better reliability or if I'd just be paying for features I won't even use. 




Edited by daveyd - 17 May 2022 at 11:09am
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  Quote Onkel_Ken Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 17 May 2022 at 2:07pm
daveyd,

Be sure that the motherboard will actually support the number of PCI slots needed since sometimes the size of one card may prevent the use of another PCI slot. I have a RTX 3080 that is so big that it prevents using the other big PCI slot since it would block the fans if it would fit at all. One of the small PCI slots is also blocked by the huge RTX 3080.

So instead of 3 small and 2 large PCI slots I have use of 1 each. I have them both in use so I am maxed out.

Having Bluetooth on the MB is nice. I use Bluetooth for my x-box controller when I play racing games.



Edited by Onkel_Ken - 17 May 2022 at 2:16pm
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  Quote db188 Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 17 May 2022 at 3:06pm
see if they offer the Asus TUF B550M-Plus.  it's a more durable line.
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  Quote daveyd Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 24 May 2022 at 6:58pm
Originally posted by db188

see if they offer the Asus TUF B550M-Plus.  it's a more durable line.


Unfortunately they don't offer any TUF gaming boards. If I do buy from DS, the one I'm leaning towards is ASUS PRIME X570-PRO.

The next step up is R
OG Strix X570-E (Wi-Fi), but that's an additional $192

Also, it's a small thing but I'm disappointed they only offer stock cooler (Wraith Stealth) for air cooling option. That's probably good enough as I'm not planning to OC, but I would at least like to be able to upgrade it to Wraith Spire. 
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  Quote db188 Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 May 2022 at 1:08am
the 12400F beats that 5600X.  the 12400F is the lowest i'd go on a new gaming build cpu.  but you have the budget to go with a custom level Lynx build which has the 12600K cpu in it, which is now into performance level tier.  you'll want to put a really good air cooler or 240mm liquid cooler on it though.  i recommend the Scythe Fuma 2 or Noctua D15 (air) or the Arctic Liquid Freezer II 280mm AIO (rad fits the specs for the Lynx in a front config).  with a 3060ti in it, that puts you just under $2K.   

edit: the Scythe Fuma 2 runs about $65 on Amazon.  the Arctic AIO LC is more expensive (but better performer) at around $110.  just have DS slap el cheapo cooler on it and then swap it out when you get it home. 


Edited by db188 - 25 May 2022 at 1:10am
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  Quote Cretae Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 May 2022 at 4:18am
Just FYI, you can also order the 12600K in a Slade build. In the Configurator, choose the Lumos and you'll have the option to change it to a Slade case. It is a significantly better CPU than the 5600X due to it's 6 faster performance cores, and the additional 4 efficiency cores. In that proc, you have 16 cores working for you, instead of 12, and it is actually the best bang-for-buck gaming CPU available. The "stock" motherboard DS recommends with that processor is already an upgrade from the base offerings. I think this combo offers you what you're looking for, and will have a longer effective lifespan. Then you can go either direction you want for CPU cooling.   
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  Quote daveyd Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 May 2022 at 6:44am
Originally posted by Cretae

Just FYI, you can also order the 12600K in a Slade build. In the Configurator, choose the Lumos and you'll have the option to change it to a Slade case. It is a significantly better CPU than the 5600X due to it's 6 faster performance cores, and the additional 4 efficiency cores. In that proc, you have 16 cores working for you, instead of 12, and it is actually the best bang-for-buck gaming CPU available. The "stock" motherboard DS recommends with that processor is already an upgrade from the base offerings. I think this combo offers you what you're looking for, and will have a longer effective lifespan. Then you can go either direction you want for CPU cooling.   


Yeah, I considered it, but DS actually requires getting a liquid cooler with the new Intel CPUs. I know it's a bit of superstition on my part but I really want to avoid liquid even if their AIO are supposed to be maintenance-free and a leak is unlikely. If not for that it would be an easy decision. 
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  Quote db188 Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 May 2022 at 9:17am
just be aware your thermals are going to suffer in the Slade case and these new components run very hot, so YMMV.  just curious, are you planning on running with a bunch of HDD's? why the "quiet" case?

they used to use rebranded "quiet" Corsair cases for the "Slade".  this 1 looks like a rebranded Cooler Master Silencio S model line (400 or 600).  reviews of the case state it's an "oven".  the NR400/600 was a superior case for balancing silence and thermals. 

you'll have to pull out the optical drive bay (top) to fit a 240mm rad in there.  do ppl still use ODD's these days? 

both models of this case support air tower cooler up to 167mm, so the Sycthe Fuma 2 (157mm tall) will fit.  the case is a front-to-back air flow case.  tower coolers will naturally help with the flow with their side-mounted fans. 

i see no reason why DS would "require" a liquid cooler, other than they don't want to hear "buyer's remorse" bitching from customers after they figure out this case won't keep their hot-running components cool enough for their tastes.  you can always go with the 12400F (which is a little faster in games than the AMD 5600X and cheaper) if you don't plan to OC as you're dropping down from a 125W cpu to a 65W cpu.  i'd drop a direct email to Alex about it and see what air cooler they can drop in your build. 




Edited by db188 - 25 May 2022 at 9:24am
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  Quote daveyd Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 May 2022 at 10:21am
Originally posted by db188

just be aware your thermals are going to suffer in the Slade case and these new components run very hot, so YMMV.  just curious, are you planning on running with a bunch of HDD's? why the "quiet" case?

they used to use rebranded "quiet" Corsair cases for the "Slade".  this 1 looks like a rebranded Cooler Master Silencio S model line (400 or 600).  reviews of the case state it's an "oven".  the NR400/600 was a superior case for balancing silence and thermals. 

you'll have to pull out the optical drive bay (top) to fit a 240mm rad in there.  do ppl still use ODD's these days? 

both models of this case support air tower cooler up to 167mm, so the Sycthe Fuma 2 (157mm tall) will fit.  the case is a front-to-back air flow case.  tower coolers will naturally help with the flow with their side-mounted fans. 

i see no reason why DS would "require" a liquid cooler, other than they don't want to hear "buyer's remorse" bitching from customers after they figure out this case won't keep their hot-running components cool enough for their tastes.  you can always go with the 12400F (which is a little faster in games than the AMD 5600X and cheaper) if you don't plan to OC as you're dropping down from a 125W cpu to a 65W cpu.  i'd drop a direct email to Alex about it and see what air cooler they can drop in your build. 




Well, while I like having a quiet PC, my interest in the Slade case was more because I don't care about lights in my case.  Also it's significantly cheaper than Lumos.  But I do care about keeping my components cool so I might have to rethink this.

It seems the configurator won't let you get the intel CPU regardless of the case. You get the red warning text that says you must select a liquid cooler.  I had heard in the past DS offered some of the larger tower air coolers like Noctua but found they were too often causing damage during shipment so they stopped offering them. 

According to the chatbot they don't do custom part orders anymore so if it's not something they have in stock you can't get it. But maybe I'll drop them an email to see what they'd suggest for my needs. 

Any idea what cases are used for the Lynx and Lumos?



Edited by daveyd - 25 May 2022 at 11:22am
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  Quote JamesAstro Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 May 2022 at 12:48pm
Yeah, it's a shame that DS can't provide big air coolers like the Noctua models. I ordered a Velox last summer. Since I live near DS, and was going to pick up my computer in person, I was able to convince them to install a Noctua DS-15S. That cooler is nearly silent, and my CPU temps are amazing. I'll never go back to liquid cooling.

That being said, I understand why DS doesn't want to ship anything with a Noctua cooler. That's some significant weight attached to the CPU, and one giant bump during shipping could cause an issue. It would be awesome if DS could design some internal supports for a cooler like that. Then maybe they would be safe to ship. That sounds like some significant engineering work that ultimately might not help though. I understand their point of view.
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  Quote db188 Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 May 2022 at 4:23pm
Originally posted by daveyd

Originally posted by db188

just be aware your thermals are going to suffer in the Slade case and these new components run very hot, so YMMV.  just curious, are you planning on running with a bunch of HDD's? why the "quiet" case?

they used to use rebranded "quiet" Corsair cases for the "Slade".  this 1 looks like a rebranded Cooler Master Silencio S model line (400 or 600).  reviews of the case state it's an "oven".  the NR400/600 was a superior case for balancing silence and thermals. 

you'll have to pull out the optical drive bay (top) to fit a 240mm rad in there.  do ppl still use ODD's these days? 

both models of this case support air tower cooler up to 167mm, so the Sycthe Fuma 2 (157mm tall) will fit.  the case is a front-to-back air flow case.  tower coolers will naturally help with the flow with their side-mounted fans. 

i see no reason why DS would "require" a liquid cooler, other than they don't want to hear "buyer's remorse" bitching from customers after they figure out this case won't keep their hot-running components cool enough for their tastes.  you can always go with the 12400F (which is a little faster in games than the AMD 5600X and cheaper) if you don't plan to OC as you're dropping down from a 125W cpu to a 65W cpu.  i'd drop a direct email to Alex about it and see what air cooler they can drop in your build. 




Well, while I like having a quiet PC, my interest in the Slade case was more because I don't care about lights in my case.  Also it's significantly cheaper than Lumos.  But I do care about keeping my components cool so I might have to rethink this.

It seems the configurator won't let you get the intel CPU regardless of the case. You get the red warning text that says you must select a liquid cooler.  I had heard in the past DS offered some of the larger tower air coolers like Noctua but found they were too often causing damage during shipment so they stopped offering them. 

According to the chatbot they don't do custom part orders anymore so if it's not something they have in stock you can't get it. But maybe I'll drop them an email to see what they'd suggest for my needs. 

Any idea what cases are used for the Lynx and Lumos?

i believe the Lynx is a Cooler Master HAF 700 and the Lumos is a Corsair Crystal Series 570X. 

spoke with them in person today.  brought up the configurator not allowing tower coolers.  they rec'd contacting them directly to config your order with an air cooler.

so, you don't need to go with a so called "silent case" (insulated) for good thermals-to-noise ratios.  i rec you watch some GamersNexus YT vids on case reviews.  they "normalize" the fans speeds to a 36 dBA "total system noise" limit, for the very reason they don't want case makers just muscling their way thru cooling performance benchmarks.  some of the best cases are: Fractal Torrent Compact (44.3 degrees on cpu/55.8 on GPU), Lian Li Lancool 215 (46.7 on cpu/52.7 gpu), Cooler Master HAF 500 (47.9 cpu/54.1 gpu), Corsair 500D Airflow (48.9 cpu/57.9 gpu), and the Fractal Meshify 2 Compact (49.1 cpu/58.9 gpu).  imo, you can't go wrong with Lian Li or Fractal cases; however, they are more pricey and you can't get them from DS:(  btw, their system builders are sad about that as well. 

if you've got a typical front to back air flow case, you're gonna want to have a mesh front and rear panel at a minimum (especially if you're closing off the side panels with full glass/steel panels and foam insulation!). 

if that Lynx is a CM HAF 500 or 700 it should be good to go. 
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  Quote Cretae Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 May 2022 at 4:27pm
The Lynx is a Digital Storm design and the Lumos is a Corsair Crystal series 570X.

db188 raises a possible real issue. When we started out, we weren't talking about a more recent CPU. For cost savings, the Lynx has better airflow than the Slade at just 8 bucks more. You can always decline the internal light strip, but you might be stuck with the fans. You could request stock fans if it's that important, and see what they say.   
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  Quote daveyd Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 May 2022 at 6:26pm
Originally posted by Cretae

The Lynx is a Digital Storm design and the Lumos is a Corsair Crystal series 570X.

db188 raises a possible real issue. When we started out, we weren't talking about a more recent CPU. For cost savings, the Lynx has better airflow than the Slade at just 8 bucks more. You can always decline the internal light strip, but you might be stuck with the fans. You could request stock fans if it's that important, and see what they say.   


Yeah, actually the configurator lets me pick standard chassis fans so I could do that. But it wasn't that big of a deal, the main thing is I do want the case with the better airflow. 

I will try to contact them to see if there's any way to get an air cooler with the i5. 

Edit: Support told me that there is a "Air Stage 2" option that would provide sufficient cooling, however they are currently out of stock. So if I really wanted it my options would be to either wait an unknown amount of time for it be restocked, or I could request that they special order one for me, which would require paying for it by wire transfer (as they won't know the exact price until they can order it).  I appreciate that they gave me this option but I'd rather not do that.

Perhaps it is time for me to just conquer my "fear" of liquid coolers. It does seem irrational to miss out on a better performing system for basically the same $.


Edited by daveyd - 27 May 2022 at 7:00pm
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  Quote daveyd Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 07 Jun 2022 at 9:16pm
Alright, I think I'm really going to go for it soon. I mean it this time Wink

After looking at benchmarks, watching some videos, etc. I think I decided that I would be quite happy with an i5-12400. It is comparable to the 5600x I was considering but cheaper and it doesn't run as hot as the 12600 so DS considers the Air Cooling Stage 1 sufficient.

Now the big question is do I go with the level 1 aka "Good" Lynx prebuilt or do a custom Lynx build?

The prebuilt Lynx 1 price is hard to beat $1249 and it has an RTX 2060 which seems like it'd be a great card for me though I'm pretty sure I'd be happy with the GTX 1660 too.

The only things that make me hesitate are

1. Windows 11 - I was really hoping to go with 10 because some people seem to really hate 11. But at least according to this article if I really hate 11 there's a way to "downgrade" to win 10. I'm hoping this is (still) accurate.

2. Storage- only 500 GB SSD. I wanted at least a 1TB so I would likely plan to add another drive soon. Other downside as it's the Digital Storm brand so not quite as good quality as the Samsung; I'm more concerned about longevity than speed differences I'm not sure I'd notice anyway. 

3. Motherboard- DS can't tell me exactly what model or even chipset it would be since it varies based on what they had in stock.  But it sounds like probably a H610 or maybe a B660.  If it's the H610, then no PCI-e 4.0 but I guess that's not really a big deal to me.

But if I don't just go with the prebuilt then I would probably go with something like this: 4414175

So what do you guys think? Is the prebuilt a better buy?  If I do go with the prebuilt what kind of SSD / HDD do you think I should get for extra storage?  (Assuming I'll still want to run some games off of it). 

Again thanks for all the input so far. 


Edited by daveyd - 07 Jun 2022 at 9:27pm
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  Quote db188 Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 07 Jun 2022 at 10:34pm
for $20 more i'd spring for a B660 mobo for the 2.5GB LAN, extra USB ports, extra x1 pci-e slot for add in cards, better VRM for power delivery, etc.  while you won't be oc'ing the cpu you can still oc the RAM, run XMP profile, and get the higher speeds out of it.  B660 supports up to 128GB of RAM as well.  you get DP, 2xHDMI, etc.  i see your build does incorporate the B660 mobo and i think it's a solid choice.

the gpu trade off is significant.  honestly, i'd consider going up to the Lynx II for just $50 more.  you get an I7 and the RX 6600XT is a big improvement.  the mobo is prob B560.

you can get a WD Black SN850 1TB for $140 on Amazon.  very fast and solid M.2 NVMe SSD.  comparable are: Samsung 980 Pro, Sabrent Rocket 4, etc.  if that's too rich, you can drop down a model, so for the WD it would be the SN750 for $119.








Edited by db188 - 07 Jun 2022 at 10:38pm
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  Quote Cretae Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 08 Jun 2022 at 4:48am
Lynx 2 might be the best idea except the mobo has only one M.2 slot. To upgrade storage, you'd have to replace the DS NVMe M.2, or add a SATA SSD, keeping the NVMe just for your OS, fave apps, and a handful of games. You could rotate the games you're playing in and out of the NVMe, but most games will load pretty well from a SATA SSD, and they're getting cheaper by the minute. It does come with the faster proc and air cooling!

The rule of thumb is you want to build for gaming around the GPU, always. I agree with db188.   
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