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System - seeking gaming build recommendations

Post Date: 2008-03-24
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Jay G View Drop Down
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  Quote Jay G Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Topic: System - seeking gaming build recommendations
    Posted: 24 Mar 2008 at 7:03pm

I have a pretty decent budget for buying my next gaming right, and I usually buy a new one every 3 years.   I bought my last two systems from Alienware, but they aren't as appealing these days (even though they offer the Duo E8500 and 790i motherboards), so I'm looking towards Digital Storm for my next purchase (have heard nothing but good things about DS).

So, first I have a bunch of questions I'm hoping the more knowledgeable folks around here can answer.  Then I have a system I've spec'd that I'm hoping folks will provide feedback and recommedations on for improving the gaming quality of the system.
 
Questions:
 
I was hoping for a 790i motherboard so that the system would actually take advantage of DDR3 memory and the higher memory speeds.  Is DS doing any 790i and DDR3 systems yet (i.e. the Asus Striker Extreme II)?  It's possible I'm just looking in the wrong place.
 
If the 790i is not available, is there any reason to go with the 780i over a 680i (the Asus Striker Extreme)?
 
If we're stuck with a 680i/780i, is the XMS2 or Dominator memory faster?  Right now the configurator says the XMS2 memory is extreme-performance while the Dominator memory is just high-performance.  I thought the Dominator memory was supposed to be faster (it's also more expensive)? 
 
Also, what's the purpose of getting the 1066 or 1250 mhz memory if it's just a 780i motherboard (which I believe only uses DDR2 memory and caps at 800 MHZ, although I could be wrong on that)? 
 
Is it worth overclocking the memory?
 
Other things I need the most help on are general config type options, such as cabling.  Is it worth the extra $22 to get improved cabling??  I have never built a computer, but I do basic replacement or addition of components (vid cards, memory, etc).  Don't really have an appreciation for what this means for the system.
 
System Feedback:
 
Here is what I've come up with so far.  I am very interested in all suggestions for improving the gaming performance of this system at reasonable cost (i.e. I don't need 2X SLI 8800GTXs or Ultras or any 3X SLI).
 
Specifications:
Case: Digital Storm 850Si (Black Anodized Aluminum Finish)
Power Supply: 850W Thermaltake (8800 GTX SLI Compatible)
Processor: Intel Core 2 Duo E8400 3.00GHz (1333MHz Front Side Bus) (6MB Cache)
Motherboard: nVidia 780i Core 2 Quad (nForce 780i SLI)
Memory: 4GB DDR2 Corsair at 800MHz XMS2 (Dual Channel) (Extreme-Performance)
Floppy / Card: - No Thanks
Hard Drive 1: 500GB Western Digital (16MB Cache) (7200 RPM) (SATA)
Hard Drive 2: 500GB Western Digital (16MB Cache) (7200 RPM) (SATA)
Raid Option: Setup hard drive 1 and 2 in a Raid 0 Stripe (Read and Write Performance Boost)
Optical Drive 1: DVD±R/RW/CD-R/RW (DVD Writer 20x / CD-Writer 48x)
Video Card: 2x SLI Dual (nVidia GeForce 8800GTS 512MB (PCI-Express)
Sound Card: Creative Sound Blaster X-Fi XtremeGamer (Recommended)
Cooling: Air Cooled Stage 2 (Silent Artic Cooling Heat-sink Upgrade (Copper Heatpipes)
Case Lighting: Blizzard Internal Lighting (Blue Edition) (Cold Cathode Tubes)
Overclock Processor: Yes, Overclock the processor as much as possible with complete stability
Overclock Video Card: Yes, Overclock the video card(s) as much as possible with complete stability
Overclock Memory: - No Thanks, Please do not overclock my memory
Tweak Windows: - No Thanks, Please do not tweak the services on the operating system
Windows OS: Microsoft Windows Vista Home Premium
 
 
 
 
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Tyler Lowe View Drop Down
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Posts: 0 		  Quote Tyler Lowe Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 24 Mar 2008 at 11:14pm
1. The 790i and DDR3 are coming soon.

2. Yes, there were improvements in the 780i which will yield better overclocking results than with a 680i on average. Better northbridge cooling, and better voltage regulators were added. The thermal interface material under the board's heatsinks was improved. The 780i supports PCI-e 2.0 (even if SLI on the board is still carried by a 1.x bridge)

3. Dominator will overclock better by virtue of it's better heatsinks. To make it clear, Dominator is the better quality RAM of the two.

4. The 780i is quite capable of supporting faster than 800MHz RAM. Even if RAM is not run at it's maximum rated MHz (and there are times when it is advantageous not to run at the max rated speed when overclocking), higher quality RAM is normally capable of much tighter timings at lower speeds.

5. I think if you are going to pay to have the CPU overclocked, you should pay to have the memory done at the same time. The two are interdependent, and if you are not comfortable overclocking the CPU yourself, you'll want DSO to tweak the timings and speed of the memory to get best performance.

6. In my opinion, no, the round cabling is a disappointment.

Before I offer suggestions to your build, do you genuinely require a terabyte of storage space? Secondly, what is your "pain point" (max budget)?


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cronedog View Drop Down
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Posts: 62 		  Quote cronedog Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 Mar 2008 at 1:06pm
The round cabling looks nice, but at 22 bucks I dont think It is worth it.  I paid for them, and now have to take the 1 cord I got out because I need a 2 headed IDE cable.

Since it is 22 bucks regardless, I wouldn't go for it unless you were getting 4 IDE devices or such.
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Jay G View Drop Down
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  Quote Jay G Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 Mar 2008 at 1:26pm
Thank you so much, Tyler.  I can see why Digital Storm has the reputation it does.
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EdH63 View Drop Down
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Posts: 1826 		  Quote EdH63 Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 Mar 2008 at 1:29pm
Actually, DS has the wonderful reputation they have because of the hookers at their Christmas parties.  Yes, they know how to partay!

Just kidding, man.  They just have female jello wrestling at their parties... no hookers.  The guy below was lat year's DJ.  He was awesome, but he could've used a tic tac...







Edited by EdH63 - 25 Mar 2008 at 1:37pm
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Jay G View Drop Down
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  Quote Jay G Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 Mar 2008 at 1:33pm
Originally posted by Tyler Lowe



Before I offer suggestions to your build, do you genuinely require a terabyte of storage space? Secondly, what is your "pain point" (max budget)?


 
Dang, can't edit my posts as a guest.  Might need to register.  Sorry for the add'l post. 
 
In response to your questions:
 
1.   Not sure - I'm using 350 gigs on my current system.  And as games continue to increase in size, and my music folder continues to grow, there's a chance I could hit that.  Is there any benefit in only utilizing a certain % of your HD?  If not, I could probably get away with 600-700 gigs.
 
On that note, would it make sense to do a Raid 0 with drives 1 & 2 and then have a 3rd OS-only drive, just in case I experience a fault with the raid 0?  I have a raid 0 on my current comp, and it hasn't had any problems for 3 years (knock on wood). 
 
2.  I would put my pain point at around $3500.  I would prefer to keep it between $2000 and $3000, unless there is some real benefit to going up to $3500.  Again, that doesn't include a monitor.
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Jay G View Drop Down
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  Quote Jay G Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 Mar 2008 at 1:34pm
Originally posted by EdH63

Actually, DS has the wonderful reputation they have because of the hookers at their Christmas parties.  Yes, they know how to partay!

Just kidding, man.  They just have female jello wrestling at their parties... no hookers.
 
Uhhh..  When do invites go out for that?
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Tyler Lowe View Drop Down
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Posts: 0 		  Quote Tyler Lowe Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 25 Mar 2008 at 11:52pm
1a. Yes there is, as data stored closer to the first sector is faster to access. Additionally, you will have an easier time performing mundane tasks such as defragmenting the drive if you keep it under 75% usage.

1b. I would recommend using a separate OS disk for a variety of reasons. Given the relatively low cost of an additional small HDD to run your OS from I can't think of a good reason not to do this.

2. The fun stuff. The only thing I would note, is that you may find the limiting factor in overclocking the E8400 to be the RAM speed. PC6400 will get you to a FSB speed of 1600 without a RAM bottleneck, which is a CPU speed of 3.6 GHz assuming a 9x muliplier. There's no garantee you're going to hit that clock or higher than that, but the RAM may become a limitation.
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bucephalusbaghdad View Drop Down
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Posts: 98 		  Quote bucephalusbaghdad Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 26 Mar 2008 at 12:11am
i see what you did there, ed.

tyler just made me question the pc i just recieved, haha. i knew i should have had them adjust the memory timings! now ive gotta murk through literature... Confused
Intel Q6600 2.94ghz
Evga Nvidia 780i Core 2 Quad
2x 1gb DDR2 Dominator @1066mhz
2x GeForce 9600GT Superclocked
2x WD HDD 250gb 7200rpm's
850w ThermalTake PSU
Silverstone Windowed TJ09
SyncMaster 953BW
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dawgs4ever View Drop Down
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Posts: 8 		  Quote dawgs4ever Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 26 Mar 2008 at 2:24pm
This is Jay G.  I'm now registered.  Thanks for your assistance, Tyler.
 
Now that the 790i and DDR3 memory is out, a couple follow up questions.  I've designed a system for not *too* much more money that is identical to the one you suggested, but now sports a 790i motherboard and 4 GB of DDR3 Corsair at 1600 Mhz Dominator DHX.   I also have the option of dropping down to 4 GB of DDR3 Corsair at 1333 Mhz for a savings of about $300. 
 
Questions:
 
1.  If I select the 1600 MhZ memory over the more basic 1333 Mhz, am I basically wasting that extra $300 because I won't see any real benefit from it if I'm only using an overclocked Core 2 Duo E8400 processor? 
 
2.  Will the use of the 790i improve the ability to overclock the E8400 as compared to a 780i motherboard?
 
Once I get the answers to the above, I'll be buying my computer.  I'm pretty much just trying to decide now whether to go with the system you suggested (perhaps upgrading that to the 1066 MHZ dominator memory for just a bit more) or whether to upgrade to the 790i and DDR3 memory (and if so, whether it's worth $300 to bump that up to the 1600 Mhz Dominator memory over the 1333 Mhz standard memory).
 
Thanks in advance!!
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dawgs4ever View Drop Down
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Posts: 8 		  Quote dawgs4ever Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 26 Mar 2008 at 2:28pm
Oh, one final question.  The new configurator doesn't have an 850 W power supply, which is a bit surprising.  I'm now left to choose between 750W and 1000W.  For the system you provided, Tyler, would a 750W power supply be enough?
 
For the same system with a 790i mobo and DDR3 memory, would I need to go with the 1000W?
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Tyler Lowe View Drop Down
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Posts: 0 		  Quote Tyler Lowe Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 27 Mar 2008 at 12:00am
When it comes to DDR3, latency becomes a larger factor to overcome. In answer to your questions, I would run a 790i, DDR3 1600MHz, and a 750W PSU. You should not need a kilowatt PSU unless you plan on running tri sli configurations with liquid cooling.

Oh, and that is going to be one seriously kick ass system. Approve


Edited by Tyler Lowe - 27 Mar 2008 at 12:01am
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SunfighterLC View Drop Down
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Posts: 1527 		  Quote SunfighterLC Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 27 Mar 2008 at 5:47am
Kinda strange that the 790i is only on the 950si...i was sitting here for almost an entire day going, where is the 790i they keep talking about..lol. My builds were usually on the 850si.
 
Im gonna get the 950si checked out to see if its okay though, i thought it was really strange when the total cost for the config on the 950si was cheaper then the one i had on the 850si...apparently i missed something that i had on the 850...it is 4am when im writing this so chances are pretty good at that.
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dawgs4ever View Drop Down
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Posts: 8 		  Quote dawgs4ever Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 27 Mar 2008 at 2:10pm
Originally posted by Tyler Lowe

When it comes to DDR3, latency becomes a larger factor to overcome. In answer to your questions, I would run a 790i, DDR3 1600MHz, and a 750W PSU. You should not need a kilowatt PSU unless you plan on running tri sli configurations with liquid cooling.

Oh, and that is going to be one seriously kick ass system. Approve
 
Thanks for all your help, Tyler!  Just ordered the system with the 790i and DDR3 1600MHz. 
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Tyler Lowe View Drop Down
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Posts: 0 		  Quote Tyler Lowe Quote  Post ReplyReply bullet Posted: 27 Mar 2008 at 11:15pm
Glad to help. Smile
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