Build for long-term (7+ years) upgradeability?

Budget:
~$7,000.00

Expectations:
In the short term, I'm looking for a PC that can run Star Citizen maxed out at 3840x2160. More importantly, I'm looking for a setup that I can keep going as long as possible with minor upgrades (RAM, GPU). I've previously built my own PCs, albeit only air-cooled or with self-contained liquid-cooled CPUs. Basically, I can do a motherboard and/or CPU swap, but I'm not so comfortable that I want to do them often!

My current build is in a Lian Li X2000FN case, which is absolutely gorgeous, but surprisingly cramped in certain spaces, and it's nearly impossible to fit in liquid cooling. One of the things that has me most intrigued about the Aventum is what looks like copious interior space and relatively easily-upgraded custom liquid cooling. If anyone has experience with adding components to the Aventum, I'd love to hear about it!

Most of my current build (sadly in trouble after nearly six years of service due to motherboard issues) probably won't help, but I did recently add a GTX 1080 Turbo, so I'll be hoping to port that over to this new build, along with a couple of SSD drives.

Usage:
As mentioned above, I want this for Star Citizen and other 4K gaming. In future I may be looking at an Occulus Rift or other VR, but don't have anything like that for now. I'll also be using this for work and research, which can involve using Stata and R with some large datasets.

Special Needs:
As mentioned above, I'll be hoping to upgrade this in future, but I don't have experience with custom liquid loops. From looking around, it looks like the Aventum 3's water block and quick connect ports could help me out there when the time comes to upgrade. I'd appreciate hearing your thoughts on whether that's an accurate reading I'm making, and on the pros and cons of the various types of tubing on offer (flexible v. hardline v. copper).

Thanks for all your help!

Saved Ticket #: 1624763

Specifications:
Chassis Model: Special Deal Hot Seller - Aventum 3 (ETA End of March)
Exterior Finish: Black Metallic Matte Finish
Trim Accents: - Standard Factory Finish
Processor: Intel Core i7 Extreme Edition 6950X 3.0GHz (10-Core) (Extreme Performance) <br><strong></strong>
Motherboard: ASUS X99-A II (Intel X99 Chipset) (Up to 4x PCI-E Devices)
System Memory: 32GB DDR4 3000MHz Digital Storm Performance Series
Power Supply: 1000W EVGA 1000 GQ
Expansion Bay: Option Not Available
Optical Drive: DVD-R/RW/CD-R/RW (DVD Writer 8x / CD-Writer 8x) (Internal)
Storage Set 1: 1x SSD M.2 (500GB Samsung 960 EVO) (NVM Express)
Storage Set 2: 1x Storage (3TB Seagate / Toshiba)
Storage Set 3: - No Thanks
RAID Config: - No Thanks
RAID Card: - No Thanks
Internet Access: High Speed Network Port (Supports High-Speed Cable / DSL / Network Connections)
Graphics Card(s): 1x GeForce GTX 1080 8GB (Performance Edition) (VR Ready) <br><strong></strong>
Sound Card: Integrated Motherboard Audio
HPC Processor: - No Thanks
Extreme Cooling: H20: HydroLux PRO: Exotic Custom Cooling System (1x Graphics Card + CPU) <br><strong></strong>
HydroLux Tubing Style: HardLine Tubing (Requires HydroLux PRO Custom Liquid Cooling System) <br><strong></strong>
HydroLux Fluid Color: White Fluid (Requires HydroLux Liquid Cooling System) <br><strong></strong>
Cable Management: Premium Cable Management (Strategically Routed & Organized for Airflow)
Chassis Fans: Corsair LED Airflow Performance Edition (White) Fans <br><strong></strong>
Internal Lighting: Digital Storm RGB LED Lighting System (Requires Thermal Management Control Board & Software)
Airflow Control: Digital Storm Thermal Management Control Board & Software
Chassis Mods: - No Thanks
Noise Reduction: - No Thanks
LaserMark: - No Thanks
Boost Processor: Stage 1: Overclock CPU - Up to 4.4GHz (Depends on Cooling and Motherboard) <br><strong></strong>
Boost Graphics Card(s): - No Thanks, Please do not overclock my video card(s)
Boost OS: - No Thanks, Please do not tweak the services on the operating system
Windows OS: Microsoft Windows 10 Professional (64-Bit Edition) <br><strong></strong>
Recovery Tools: Factory Reset Feature (Restore Windows + Drivers) (Partition up to 50GB of Storage)
Virus Protection: FREE: McAfee AntiVirus Plus (1 Year Service Activation Card) (Not Pre-installed) ($35 Value)
Office: - No Thanks
Game: - No Thanks
Display: - No Thanks
Surge Shield: - No Thanks
Speakers: - No Thanks
Keyboard: - No Thanks
Mouse: - No Thanks
Branded Gear: - No Thanks
Priority Build: - No Thanks, Ship Within 15-20 Business Days After Order Is Successfully Processed
Warranty: Life-time Expert Care with 3 Year Limited Warranty (3 Year Labor & 1 Year Part Replacement)

Thanks, vnrenshi, for your advice!

I was thinking the same re: the processor being overkill. But I wanted the full 40 lanes (so not the 6800), and I believe Stata will use as many cores as you can throw at it, so I did see a bit of an upside for work there. That, and I really don't want to be having to upgrade the processor for a few years at least. I'll definitely think your recommendation over though.

As I mentioned, I already have one 1080 on hand, so this will have two from the beginning -- do you still think I'll be bottlenecked if I don't hold out for the TIs?

1) For the 1080 Turbo, EK does not make a full cover water block for it. You could still use it with a universal block that covers only the GPU, but you'll need to make sure you have finned heat sinks with air flow over the VRMs and memory to cool them.

2) You don't get quick disconnect fittings with the hardline set-up. Only in the flexible tubing do you get them.

3) There is an RGB header on the motherboard and the fan headers are PWM and aplenty. I'd consider just using the motherboard to control the RGB and fans.

To add another GPU to a water cooled system wouldn't be the easiest of things. You'll have to remove the cooler that is on your GPU, apply thermal paste and attach the universal block, and then apply finned heat sinks (probably "pin fin" would be best for you) to the memory chips and VRMs with adhesive thermal pads. You'd probably place it in the upper slot (board is reversed from normal, so lower slot if looking at it right side up) which should put it in the path of the down draft from the radiator on top in addition to the airflow coming from the front. You then will need to partially drain the water loop to be able to remove the return tube from the GPU and install your other GPU in the loop. You will either want to change out the terminals on the water blocks to install a bridge terminal, or just install a couple tubes with G1/4" fittings to connect both into the loop. You'd then add the SLI HB bridge, refill your loop, and get the computer going again.

I'm not trying to discourage you from trying this, but it is a bit of effort that you should be aware of.

If you want a simpler path, I'd recommend just getting two GTX 1080Ti cards and let DS do all of the work. I put two such builds below.

As for the processor, if you are capable of fully utilizing all of the threads a processor has to offer, you could benefit from a 6950X, especially if that means you can do more in less time for your work, making it worth the expense.

If you aren't subject to high memory bandwidth requirements, you could consider opting for the new AMD Ryzen processor for a good deal less. It does have two less cores than the 6950X, but can get a little bit higher clock speeds (roughly equivalent number of Instructions-per-clock). It does only have two memory channels, instead of the 6950X's four, but that is more than enough bandwidth for gaming, at least. There will also only be x8 connections to the GPUs, instead of full x16, so if you have critical needs for CPU-GPU communication where you can saturate that link, that would also be something to consider, but again, as far as gaming is concerned, it's a non-issue. High points for the AMD system are that performance will improve over time as the BIOS gets fleshed out (right now there's an issue with poor memory performance holding these processors back; you'll want to upgrade your memory down the road to take advantage of new BIOS' and allow for better CPU performance). Also, the platform has more greater longevity...AMD has said this platform will be used through 2020; X99 will be obsolete in the second half of this year to X299, as Intel changes the platform regularly around every three years.

Config # 1625370 Chassis Chassis Model: Aventum 3 (ETA End of March) Exterior Finish: Black Metallic Matte Finish Core Components Processor: Intel Core i7 Extreme Edition 6950X 3.0GHz (10-Core) (Extreme Performance) Motherboard: ASUS X99-A II (Intel X99 Chipset) (Up to 4x PCI-E Devices) System Memory: 32GB DDR4 3000MHz Digital Storm Performance Series Power Supply: 1000W EVGA 1000 GQ Storage / Connectivity Optical Drive: DVD-R/RW/CD-R/RW (DVD Writer 8x / CD-Writer 8x) (Internal) Storage Set 1: 1x SSD M.2 (500GB Samsung 960 EVO) (NVM Express) Storage Set 2: 1x Storage (4TB Western Digital - Black Edition) Internet Access: High Speed Network Port (Supports High-Speed Cable / DSL / Network Connections) Graphics / Multimedia Graphics Card(s): 2x SLI Dual (GeForce GTX - Latest GeneraTIon NVIDIA Graphics Card) Sound Card: Integrated Motherboard Audio Digital Storm Engineering Extreme Cooling: H20: HydroLux PRO: Exotic Custom Cooling System (2x Graphics Cards + CPU) HydroLux Tubing Style: Flexible Tubing (Requires HydroLux Liquid Cooling System) HydroLux Fluid Color: White Fluid (Requires HydroLux Liquid Cooling System) Cable Management: Exotic Cable Management - White - (Cable Combs with Custom Color Sleeved Extension Cables) Chassis Fans: Corsair LED Airflow Performance Edition (White) Fans Internal Lighting: Remote Controlled LED Lighting System (Multiple color options and lighting effects) Digital Storm TwisterBoost Technology Boost Processor: Stage 1: Overclock CPU - Up to 4.4GHz (Depends on Cooling and Motherboard) Software Windows OS: Microsoft Windows 10 Home (64-Bit Edition) Recovery Tools: Windows 10 Installation CD Only (Clean Install with No Drivers)

Config # 1625371 Chassis Chassis Model: Aventum 3 (ETA End of March) Exterior Finish: Black Metallic Matte Finish Core Components Processor: AMD Ryzen 7 1800X (8-Core) 3.6 GHz (4.0 GHz Turbo) Motherboard: ASUS ROG Crosshair VI Hero (AMD X370 Chipset) (Up to 4x PCI-E Devices) System Memory: 32GB DDR4 2666MHz Digital Storm Performance Series Power Supply: 1000W EVGA 1000 GQ Storage / Connectivity Optical Drive: DVD-R/RW/CD-R/RW (DVD Writer 8x / CD-Writer 8x) (Internal) Storage Set 1: 1x SSD M.2 (500GB Samsung 960 EVO) (NVM Express) Storage Set 2: 1x Storage (4TB Western Digital - Black Edition) Internet Access: High Speed Network Port (Supports High-Speed Cable / DSL / Network Connections) Graphics / Multimedia Graphics Card(s): 2x SLI Dual (GeForce GTX - Latest GeneraTIon NVIDIA Graphics Card) Sound Card: Integrated Motherboard Audio Digital Storm Engineering Extreme Cooling: H20: HydroLux PRO: Exotic Custom Cooling System (2x Graphics Cards + CPU) HydroLux Tubing Style: Flexible Tubing (Requires HydroLux Liquid Cooling System) HydroLux Fluid Color: White Fluid (Requires HydroLux Liquid Cooling System) Cable Management: Exotic Cable Management - White - (Cable Combs with Custom Color Sleeved Extension Cables) Chassis Fans: Corsair LED Airflow Performance Edition (White) Fans Internal Lighting: Remote Controlled LED Lighting System (Multiple color options and lighting effects) Digital Storm TwisterBoost Technology Boost Processor: Stock Factory Turbo Boost Advanced Automatic Overclocking Software Windows OS: Microsoft Windows 10 Home (64-Bit Edition) Recovery Tools: Windows 10 Installation CD Only (Clean Install with No Drivers)

I forgot to ask about ECC needs. The Ryzen chips support it, but is dependent on motherboard support and validation. A number of applications still need to be made compatible with Ryzen, but it'll come. Here are some early benchmarks for HPC applications. I should also note that if you have heavy high precision vector computations, Ryzen's architecture would be at a disadvantage there, as they traded off vector compute units for reduced die space.

Here's some drool-worthy information of AMD's upcoming server chip: https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2017/03/amd-naples-server-processor-more-cores-bandwidth-memory-than-intel/ Not sure if there will be any workstation motherboards for it, but it surely a very capable processor.

If you wanted ECC on Intel, you'll want a Xeon processor. DS has the Aventum 3 Pro with the Xeon processors. You can also get ECC on the GPUs with Nvidia Quadro, but expect the cost to go way up. The GP100 are the most powerful GPU's on the market, but they go for $7k each. The P6000 are slightly up-spec'ed versions of the Titan X with a no disabled parts of the die and double the VRAM, but costs $5k each.

Here is a list of Intel Xeon server CPUs that support ECC. If you have NUMA-enabled software, you could take advantage of having multiple processors, too.

They don't have the GTX 1080 Ti cards in the configurator in the Pro, but 2 should run just a few hundred more than a single Titan X.

Config # 1626354 Chassis Chassis Model: Aventum 3 (ETA End of March) Exterior Finish: Black Metallic Matte Finish Core Components Processor: Intel Xeon E5-2687W v4 (12-Core) 3.0GHz (9.6 QPI) (30MB Cache) (2400MHz Memory Max Speed) Motherboard: ASUS X99-E WS/USB 3.1 (Intel X99 Chipset) (Workstation Class) (Up to 5x PCI-E Devices) System Memory: 32GB DDR4 2400MHz (ECC Registered) (8GB x 4) Power Supply: 1000W EVGA 1000 GQ Storage / Connectivity Optical Drive: DVD-R/RW/CD-R/RW (DVD Writer 8x / CD-Writer 8x) (Internal) Storage Set 1: 1x SSD M.2 (500GB Samsung 960 EVO) (NVM Express) Storage Set 2: 1x Storage (4TB Western Digital - Black Edition) Internet Access: High Speed Network Port (Supports High-Speed Cable / DSL / Network Connections) Graphics / Multimedia Graphics Card(s): 1x GeForce GTX TITAN X 12GB (Pascal) (NVIDIA Founders Edition) (VR Ready) Sound Card: Integrated Motherboard Audio Digital Storm Engineering Extreme Cooling: H20: HydroLux PRO: Exotic Custom Cooling System (2x Graphics Cards + CPU) HydroLux Tubing Style: Flexible Tubing (Requires HydroLux Liquid Cooling System) HydroLux Fluid Color: White Fluid (Requires HydroLux Liquid Cooling System) Cable Management: Exotic Cable Management - White - (Cable Combs with Custom Color Sleeved Extension Cables) Chassis Fans: Corsair LED Airflow Performance Edition (White) Fans Internal Lighting: Remote Controlled LED Lighting System (Multiple color options and lighting effects) Digital Storm TwisterBoost Technology Boost Processor: Stock Factory Turbo Boost Advanced Automatic Overclocking Software Windows OS: Microsoft Windows 10 Home (64-Bit Edition) Recovery Tools: Windows 10 Installation CD Only (Clean Install with No Drivers)

Edited by  - 07 Mar 2017 at 2:32pm

Wanted to pop back in here and thank you all for your advice!  especially -- I ended up going with a rig that is nearly identical to your recommended X99 system, except I ended up downgrading to the 6900K. Looking over my likely usage, I really couldn't justify the extra expense for two more cores. I really thought through the Ryzen, which looked like incredible value for money, but I'm a little gun-shy given the price of this rig and the inconsistency in support for the processor at launch. Long-term, that probably would have been a better value play, but I'm a bit risk-averse right now, as I'm sure you can understand!

Most importantly, though, thank you for your interest, and for taking the time to walk me through my earlier water cooling questions. I feel much more confident in this purchase, and I'm excited for it to arrive! Will post photos and a quick review when it does!

Short update: shipped yesterday!

Night falls, and now my wait begins....